I need to reduce the amount of loudspeaker noise transferred from my listening room into our lounge.
At the moment, I have bi-fold doors which have gaps everywhere.
For aesthetic reasons, I must use glazed doors so I know the result won't be as good as is possible, but it will be better than I've got. I'm planning on using 2 No. of doors similar to below.
I've found Lorient acoustic seals. In particular AAS7503 perimeter seal and AAS7506 meeting stile seal look as though they should be fairly simple to fit.
All comments / advice welcome.
Thanks in advance,
Barry
At the moment, I have bi-fold doors which have gaps everywhere.
For aesthetic reasons, I must use glazed doors so I know the result won't be as good as is possible, but it will be better than I've got. I'm planning on using 2 No. of doors similar to below.
I've found Lorient acoustic seals. In particular AAS7503 perimeter seal and AAS7506 meeting stile seal look as though they should be fairly simple to fit.
All comments / advice welcome.
Thanks in advance,
Barry
At the Jambs this stuff works pretty well https://isostore.com/pds-rubber-high-performance-rubber-door-seal-html.html
Double doors are hard. You will have the most problems with the bottom of the door and at the joint between them. Drop sweeps work okay on the bottom. the best option for fitting to a standard door is a set like they sell here Acoustical solutions. Its the small gaps that kill you so a full set including threshold works the best. Beyond that you are into acoustical doors with interlocking edges which are expensive as all get out and are really tough to hang properly.
Double doors are hard. You will have the most problems with the bottom of the door and at the joint between them. Drop sweeps work okay on the bottom. the best option for fitting to a standard door is a set like they sell here Acoustical solutions. Its the small gaps that kill you so a full set including threshold works the best. Beyond that you are into acoustical doors with interlocking edges which are expensive as all get out and are really tough to hang properly.
Sound travels through air, so air-tight is the trick. The heavier the glass, or better, thermo-pane will help. Basically, just exterior door set and jams. Having the threshold is the biggest problem, so the drop threshold is the only decent solution.
Besides bothering outer house mates is a leaky door detrimental to the listening room's acoustics?
It depends how loud I want to listen to the music and how much bass I want to feel. My speakers can pressurise the room and it will be easier to pressurise the room without a leaky door.
I think I'm going to be lucky to get > 20 dB attenuation using glazed doors and seals around them.
I'm still looking for seals which I can put around the door. Standard internal doors in the UK are not designed to have a piece routed out of the bottom for a drop down seal. My original idea of perimeter seals on one side and a style seal at the front is flawed, There is a weakness of 35mm (door thickness) at the top & bottom of the door which noise can pass through.
I think I'm going to be lucky to get > 20 dB attenuation using glazed doors and seals around them.
I'm still looking for seals which I can put around the door. Standard internal doors in the UK are not designed to have a piece routed out of the bottom for a drop down seal. My original idea of perimeter seals on one side and a style seal at the front is flawed, There is a weakness of 35mm (door thickness) at the top & bottom of the door which noise can pass through.
The doors you have now are next to useless from an attenuation point of view, with lightweight construction and gaps everywhere. The seals around the doors need to be airtight, which can be achieve with conventional door jambs and properly fitted doors, even doubles, with appropriately fitted stick-on rubber sealing strips and drop seals for the bottom. Commercial / industrial seals won't necessarily work any better and just as much care needs to be applied to ensure they actually seal. You'll need 10mm thick laminated 'hush' glass for such large areas of glass.
The other thing to consider is how air will escape if you have central air. The pressurized room could send more air through the window to the outside.
Other air sealing/sound deadening tricks, seal the outlet boxes and ceiling light boxes etc.
Other air sealing/sound deadening tricks, seal the outlet boxes and ceiling light boxes etc.
I custom fit an all weather exterior solid core door (steel with heavy foam core) inside and sealed the top and sides of the jam air tight. I had to chop and channel 1.75" from two edges in order to fit it. It might not be the best option but its better than what they put in newer houses. I should get sealing up the bottom with something on the weekend.
I bought a role of heavy 4" rubber but I'm thinking I'll need that and a piece of wooden filler to shut the 1" gap thats left at the bottom.
With glass, mass is king, however at certain parts of the frequency spectrum the noise transmission of double and triple-glazed units will exceed that of a single pane of glass of equal total thickness. (eg. 4/20/4 vs 8mm). Double glazing though remains a simple and cost-effective means of increasing mass without the cost of exceptionally thick glass. (28mm laminated is about £600.00 per square meter for example...).
The spacing of double panes from a noise attenuation point of view is virtually irrelevant unless it reaches 150mm or more. Use unequal glass thickness and ordinary laminated glass, which is considerably cheaper than 'acoustic' laminated without too much of a performance penalty. Consider 8.8mm PVB laminated and 6.8mm PVB laminated (thick pane towards source) as a starting point from which you should expect a healthy -30dB at 250Hz rising to -40dB as frequency increases, but more really is more in this instance, especially for lower frequencies!
Performance will of course be destroyed by any direct air paths. Use double seals around the periphery plus a solid flexible hinge-side cover seal and a drop seal against a hard strip under the door threshold. Don't forget that the door hardware should also be sealed. If your house is modern then the ultimate noise transmission could be limited by lightweight wall construction and flanking, however even single skin brick-built walls can be surprising poor at some frequencies and even possess significant high-Q resonances at single-digit frequencies. Mounting a turntable on the wall shelf is never a good idea given that the arm/cantilever resonance frequency occurs at a similar value!
This company is long-established and exceptionally good:
Noise reduction supplies
The spacing of double panes from a noise attenuation point of view is virtually irrelevant unless it reaches 150mm or more. Use unequal glass thickness and ordinary laminated glass, which is considerably cheaper than 'acoustic' laminated without too much of a performance penalty. Consider 8.8mm PVB laminated and 6.8mm PVB laminated (thick pane towards source) as a starting point from which you should expect a healthy -30dB at 250Hz rising to -40dB as frequency increases, but more really is more in this instance, especially for lower frequencies!
Performance will of course be destroyed by any direct air paths. Use double seals around the periphery plus a solid flexible hinge-side cover seal and a drop seal against a hard strip under the door threshold. Don't forget that the door hardware should also be sealed. If your house is modern then the ultimate noise transmission could be limited by lightweight wall construction and flanking, however even single skin brick-built walls can be surprising poor at some frequencies and even possess significant high-Q resonances at single-digit frequencies. Mounting a turntable on the wall shelf is never a good idea given that the arm/cantilever resonance frequency occurs at a similar value!
This company is long-established and exceptionally good:
Noise reduction supplies
Renovations are at an all time high this past couple years. You can find solid wood 9 panel doors on kijiji for so little money in my city. Or they often get put out to the curb by people wanting ultra modern upgrades. Wooded everything seems to be at an all time low in popularity, including high end furniture. Its sometimes hard to give the stuff away.
If it were me I would change out the glass for a solid wooden door then paint it to suit the décor. It can easily be reversed if you decide to sell the place or if the WAF proves to be unmanageable.
I enclosed my double glazed windows in my studio with solid wooden louvers. The large window sounded terrible, even with extra thick curtains covering it. Sound managed to get back there and create varying levels of glare. Glass is the worst for acoustics as we all know.
If it were me I would change out the glass for a solid wooden door then paint it to suit the décor. It can easily be reversed if you decide to sell the place or if the WAF proves to be unmanageable.
I enclosed my double glazed windows in my studio with solid wooden louvers. The large window sounded terrible, even with extra thick curtains covering it. Sound managed to get back there and create varying levels of glare. Glass is the worst for acoustics as we all know.
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Something like dynamat would cut reflection and give it a frosted privacy look. At least that could help with glare, won't do anything for the gaps of course. https://www.dynamat.com/applications-industries/home-architectural/
I thought they made some intended for glass? Without the logo smeared all over it. Perhaps they stopped making it. That I can't say.
I thought they made some intended for glass? Without the logo smeared all over it. Perhaps they stopped making it. That I can't say.
You need solid heavy doors, seal all the gaps around so add matching "lips" wherever necessary and use double glass, as in one on the inside surface, one on the outside one, sealed with putty.
What Recording/Radio studios or rock band rehearsal rooms use, I built/set up lots of them.
Of course your doors will need to be custom built so glass on each side is flush or slightly rebated.
Very good hinges and strong door locks, think commercial cool storage room type.
What Recording/Radio studios or rock band rehearsal rooms use, I built/set up lots of them.
Of course your doors will need to be custom built so glass on each side is flush or slightly rebated.
Very good hinges and strong door locks, think commercial cool storage room type.
Thanks for all of your input. The existing oak door frame - door stop and rebate is cut for a 35 mm thick door, which limits my options to internal doors or custom made. You can see one of my speakers in post 1 - so from a WAF perspective I get away with a lot, but I need to retain glazing.
Using 24 kg doors, I can fit seals such as below and achieve 25 - 30 dB reduction - maybe £400.
Alternatively it's bespoke doors in the region of £2k +to achieve > 40 dB
Using 24 kg doors, I can fit seals such as below and achieve 25 - 30 dB reduction - maybe £400.
Alternatively it's bespoke doors in the region of £2k +to achieve > 40 dB
I've managed to find some better perimeter seals in the UK - https://www.norseal.co.uk/acoustic-seals/
NOR710 - £2.83 per 2100mm
There's also NOR720 - £3.04 per 2100mm for between the doors & NOR820 @ £23.90 ea.
Buy direct from manf 🙂
NOR710 - £2.83 per 2100mm
There's also NOR720 - £3.04 per 2100mm for between the doors & NOR820 @ £23.90 ea.
Buy direct from manf 🙂