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I would have thought the electronics would be crude and simple (like all valve stuff), it's the mechanics that are likely to be the difficult part.
Hmmmmm, i would think the mechanics are the easy part! Im somewhat of a beginner in electronics, so it all looks kinda complicated and difficult!
ramalamafafafa said:
Why do you wish to try and built such an antique anyway?, things have moved on a lot since then 😀
So what particular problems are you having, or anticipating?.
Im basicly thinking it will be a mind numbing task to follow a schematic that large (its all sorta large to me, as ive not been into electronics for very long!!!). I realy love the sound of those old echo units......................they've long since become outmoded and obsolete, but they have a strange sound quality to them that i dig. (it could be described as "fantasticly lo-fi and crappy!"). This particular unit has a number of sounds and features i like....Anyone who has ever watched and enjoyed an early pink floyd vid knows what im talkin' 'bout!
ramalamafafafa said:
I suspect that the sound you like isn't so much this particular unit, but the quality and skills of Pink Floyd 😀
Like I said before though, the electronics looks pretty simple, just a collection of triodes - but the mechanical part is likely to be tricky, and probably requires special transformers to interface to as well.
Yes and no. Ive also heard rather terrible guitarists play through it and i still loved its tone....i have a schematic, im just a little bit...............................overwhelmed???? (i can read em, just.............)
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm, i think the mechanical part is basicly a motor running from the transformer, fairly simple i would think. You are right, the electronics are realy just a number of triodes (six to be exact).
ramalamafafafa said:
How would that give echo?, you need to record the audio, and play it back after a delay - from the Binson website
Well yes, the motor spins a metal disc which has a number of playback haeds, a record head, and a erase head. As the disc spins, the signal is recorded to the disc, then played back via the playback heads. It is essentialy a tape player, like all tape/disc echos. Probably should have added that "minor" detail!
Binson echo units
Hi, I used to service Binsons in the '60's and I've got to say that they were absolutely superb. 90% of the problems were caused by owners dropping them or getting them wet.
They'd transplanted studio quality tape recorder circuitry into a portable unit, so the frequency response was pretty close to flat.
The mechanical arrangement with the big flywheel meant that the wow and flutter figures performance was as good as you could get and there was no tape-joint to make regular clicks.
The magnetic rim on the flywheel needed a higher level of signal than a tape but gave more output - like metal tape - so the signal to noise ratio was also better. This was especially important with the AC motor so close - you couldn't hear any hum in the output.
The heads were the weak point in the design - they ran in contact with the drum, so they wore over a period of time. The newer Ferrite heads might do better...
The gap in the front of the heads tended to get wider as they wore, so the high frequencies dropped off - about 1000 hours of use was the cutoff point.
The number of heads was also important - units like the Copycat and Swissecho never had as many, so they just couldn't offer the same range of effects. In particular, the tape speed meant that they didn't have the really short delays which were useful for a double-tracked sound.
The later transistorised models sounded just as good when they were new, but were less reliable.
I have no idea where you'd get the flywheel made nowadays - there isn't a public specification for the magnetic alloy, so you'd have to experiment.
Likewise the heads - I'm not aware of anyone making heads suitable for the higher drive levels - perhaps Binson could supply some spares?
Graham.
Hi, I used to service Binsons in the '60's and I've got to say that they were absolutely superb. 90% of the problems were caused by owners dropping them or getting them wet.
They'd transplanted studio quality tape recorder circuitry into a portable unit, so the frequency response was pretty close to flat.
The mechanical arrangement with the big flywheel meant that the wow and flutter figures performance was as good as you could get and there was no tape-joint to make regular clicks.
The magnetic rim on the flywheel needed a higher level of signal than a tape but gave more output - like metal tape - so the signal to noise ratio was also better. This was especially important with the AC motor so close - you couldn't hear any hum in the output.
The heads were the weak point in the design - they ran in contact with the drum, so they wore over a period of time. The newer Ferrite heads might do better...
The gap in the front of the heads tended to get wider as they wore, so the high frequencies dropped off - about 1000 hours of use was the cutoff point.
The number of heads was also important - units like the Copycat and Swissecho never had as many, so they just couldn't offer the same range of effects. In particular, the tape speed meant that they didn't have the really short delays which were useful for a double-tracked sound.
The later transistorised models sounded just as good when they were new, but were less reliable.
I have no idea where you'd get the flywheel made nowadays - there isn't a public specification for the magnetic alloy, so you'd have to experiment.
Likewise the heads - I'm not aware of anyone making heads suitable for the higher drive levels - perhaps Binson could supply some spares?
Graham.
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