Hey guys
Im seriously considering buying a pair of these as a second reference monitor alongside my Genelec 1032A's however they are horrendously expensive on ebay. So im wondering if anyone has ever built a pair of these or something very similar. Failing that does anyone know of any links to guides showing how to build a pair or these. Im pretty handy with woodwork but am very new to electronics (I can solder but thats about as far as my knowledge goes, although I am keen to learn) so please keep your answers as simple as possible.
Thanks for the help
Ben
Im seriously considering buying a pair of these as a second reference monitor alongside my Genelec 1032A's however they are horrendously expensive on ebay. So im wondering if anyone has ever built a pair of these or something very similar. Failing that does anyone know of any links to guides showing how to build a pair or these. Im pretty handy with woodwork but am very new to electronics (I can solder but thats about as far as my knowledge goes, although I am keen to learn) so please keep your answers as simple as possible.
Thanks for the help
Ben
Hi
I think it would be impossible to replicate the NS10 design without using the actual Yamaha drivers. You could get a hold of the replacement drivers and build cabs and a copy of the Xover but it still would be an expensive clone and no guarantee of the original sound/the resale value of the original. You could build something nearby and better though. Not sure of the reason you want to have NS10's compared to what you have currently unless?
I think it would be impossible to replicate the NS10 design without using the actual Yamaha drivers. You could get a hold of the replacement drivers and build cabs and a copy of the Xover but it still would be an expensive clone and no guarantee of the original sound/the resale value of the original. You could build something nearby and better though. Not sure of the reason you want to have NS10's compared to what you have currently unless?
Hi,
http://www.studiospares.com/Studio-Monitors/Studiospares-SN10-Nearfield-Monitors-Pair/invt/248000
The drivers are £22+VAT, the bass units better value than the tweeters.
Seems pointless buying them though given the cost of a complete pair.
🙂/sreten.
http://www.studiospares.com/Studio-Monitors/Studiospares-SN10-Nearfield-Monitors-Pair/invt/248000
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
The drivers are £22+VAT, the bass units better value than the tweeters.
Seems pointless buying them though given the cost of a complete pair.
🙂/sreten.
As a person who has recorded in several studios and mixed on the NS10s, I can understand the desire to use them... if for no other reason than they are a "standard."
However, they do also have a "trick" built into them. Their response is far from perfect, but the mix engineer can use this to his or her benefit. That is: if you can get the mix right on a pair of NS10s, it will probably sound good on the vast majority of systems. Audiophile systems, probably not. But any average car stereo, boombox, headphone, home stereo, etc. your mix will sound right.
I can understand why a company would clone the design, but in order to do that, they'd have to match the funky FR that comes with the NS10. And increasing bass output (as that "Studiospares" company did) would NOT help make a better mix. If there's one problem I've noticed while mixing it's that if the bass response is really deep and clean on the studio monitors, when you go play the mix back on a normal system or in a car, the bass sounds very rolled-off (especially the kick drum).
So sorry, I just don't know about cloning the NS10, unless you found drivers with VERY similar distortion profiles and FR... then you designed the clone with a matching FR. It's not to say it could never happen; I mean look at how many times--and how many different ways--the TB-303, TR-808 and TR-909 have been cloned now (quite successfully, too!)
However, they do also have a "trick" built into them. Their response is far from perfect, but the mix engineer can use this to his or her benefit. That is: if you can get the mix right on a pair of NS10s, it will probably sound good on the vast majority of systems. Audiophile systems, probably not. But any average car stereo, boombox, headphone, home stereo, etc. your mix will sound right.
I can understand why a company would clone the design, but in order to do that, they'd have to match the funky FR that comes with the NS10. And increasing bass output (as that "Studiospares" company did) would NOT help make a better mix. If there's one problem I've noticed while mixing it's that if the bass response is really deep and clean on the studio monitors, when you go play the mix back on a normal system or in a car, the bass sounds very rolled-off (especially the kick drum).
So sorry, I just don't know about cloning the NS10, unless you found drivers with VERY similar distortion profiles and FR... then you designed the clone with a matching FR. It's not to say it could never happen; I mean look at how many times--and how many different ways--the TB-303, TR-808 and TR-909 have been cloned now (quite successfully, too!)
Hi guys thanks for the quick responses. Yes the reason I want these speakers is that they make a great "grot box" which means they give you a great idea of what your mix is going to sound like on everyday crappy speakers and beyond that it does seem that if you get your mix sounding really good on NS10's it really will translate very well to other speakers which is exactly what you need when mixing music for commercial release. The studiospares versions unfortunately don't sound anything like the NS10s and they seem to have missed the point that people don't actually want the extra bass.
My plan was to either find very similar driver/tweeter/crossover combo or eventually find replacement drivers on ebay going cheap and then build my own cabinet. However, im interested to know if anyone could come up with a design that would be very cheap yet satisfy all the features that make the ns10m so popular in studios. Have a look at http://www.ns-10.net/ for some details on them or even better if you are a sound on sound subscriber there is an indepth discussion on what makes them so good at http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/sep08/articles/yamahans10.htm. If someone can come up with the design who is more knowledgeable then I am then I for one would definitely be interested in it and I dare say a whole host of others would be too.
Anyway, thanks a lot for the suggestions made already.
Ben
My plan was to either find very similar driver/tweeter/crossover combo or eventually find replacement drivers on ebay going cheap and then build my own cabinet. However, im interested to know if anyone could come up with a design that would be very cheap yet satisfy all the features that make the ns10m so popular in studios. Have a look at http://www.ns-10.net/ for some details on them or even better if you are a sound on sound subscriber there is an indepth discussion on what makes them so good at http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/sep08/articles/yamahans10.htm. If someone can come up with the design who is more knowledgeable then I am then I for one would definitely be interested in it and I dare say a whole host of others would be too.
Anyway, thanks a lot for the suggestions made already.
Ben
Have a look at the FR graphs here (paper is in swedish):
http://www.lts.a.se/Portals/0/artiklar/YamahaNS10.pdf
If you really want to replicate that, how about starting with a driver something like this:
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-9063-W170/W+170+-+8+Ohm
http://www.lts.a.se/Portals/0/artiklar/YamahaNS10.pdf
If you really want to replicate that, how about starting with a driver something like this:
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-9063-W170/W+170+-+8+Ohm
I'm not sure what the filters are for on Ingmar's page, but rather than build a crappy speaker, it might be better to replicate that FR using a filter, which could be switched in and out of the signal chain...????
Yeah, if I got my hands on a pair, I'd definitely measure everything I could about the design ,and also the drivers' FR and T/S specs (in-cab and flat-baffle) and do my best to create a clone design for studio engineer wannabes. 😉 (and no, I'm not in it for the money. so I'd just put the design up on my site... if you wanted it, you'd have to build it yourself 😀)benjamink18 said:
Jeff Bagby has been working quite laboriously for the last few years to clone the LS3/5A studio monitor. He went through a lot of drivers and iterations. He read a lot of whitepapers to find out how they did what they did. In the end, he used much lower-distortion drivers, but the FR is a match to the original. (I think the design is called "Continuum" and it uses the Aurum Cantus AC130F1 + Dayton RS28a.) I heard them at InDIYana 2008 and they sounded like a truly excellent set of nearfield monitors. However, part of me wonders if using the lower-distortion drivers would create a different "sound feel" than the original. <shrug> Having never heard the original LS3/5A, I can't really say for sure.
-Paul
Wow that response is hideous. But it really works huh? I would think you'd need to get the most revealing and accurate set of speakers possible for your job then sanity check on actual junk, not an expensive simulation of junk. Just put a ghetto blaster in the room. What do I know though...
here's a US source for the drivers at $125 each (tweeter and woofer).
http://tinyurl.com/3o4xku
At $500 just for the drivers and still needing to do the crossover and box, I would think buying secondhand makes a lot more sense, especially since the result of all your work would have so little re-sale value compared to the genuine article.
http://tinyurl.com/3o4xku
At $500 just for the drivers and still needing to do the crossover and box, I would think buying secondhand makes a lot more sense, especially since the result of all your work would have so little re-sale value compared to the genuine article.
PeteMcK said:
The filter in the pdf IS for replicating the FR of this Lo-Fi "monitor". The author of the article is the person behing the Guru pro audio loudspeakers. 🙂
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