Recently moved country and so to new digs. Planning for what I should bring from a distance I was expecting to be in a much smaller place. Hence I packed a wee pair of Royds Minstrels that I would not mourn too much if they got damaged or lost in transit; and they are a convenient size for transport - yes, I'd be sad to lose them but not too much.
The freight is still on its way but I am expecting the Minstrels will be much too small to adequately fill the living space I find myself with - must be about 30ftx30ft with 10ft high ceilings. I have wanted my next speakers to be my first DIY set and have looked at many types and styles. Recently I have been settling on Econowaves; I like what I have read of listening impressions; they seem simple enough in design that I can manage them if I get wood cut to size.
Knowing that there are some reasonable drivers manufactured locally for SB Acoustics and ACR I have been looking at what they offer in 12"
As I don't know what I should look for on Freq response charts etc. I am turning to DA for some help to have a quick squizz at the following. I am sure each would make a speaker that makes sound but is there a better one out of this lot for use in an Econowave design. Thanks
12" SB34NRX75-6 :: SB Acoustics
12" SB34NRXL75-8 :: SB Acoustics
12” PA- 75124 W-N FABULOUS BY ACR | ACR Speaker
12″ ARRAY 3060 M FABULOUS BY ACR | ACR Speaker
The freight is still on its way but I am expecting the Minstrels will be much too small to adequately fill the living space I find myself with - must be about 30ftx30ft with 10ft high ceilings. I have wanted my next speakers to be my first DIY set and have looked at many types and styles. Recently I have been settling on Econowaves; I like what I have read of listening impressions; they seem simple enough in design that I can manage them if I get wood cut to size.
Knowing that there are some reasonable drivers manufactured locally for SB Acoustics and ACR I have been looking at what they offer in 12"
As I don't know what I should look for on Freq response charts etc. I am turning to DA for some help to have a quick squizz at the following. I am sure each would make a speaker that makes sound but is there a better one out of this lot for use in an Econowave design. Thanks
12" SB34NRX75-6 :: SB Acoustics
12" SB34NRXL75-8 :: SB Acoustics
12” PA- 75124 W-N FABULOUS BY ACR | ACR Speaker
12″ ARRAY 3060 M FABULOUS BY ACR | ACR Speaker
Where did you move to? Somewhere in s e asia? That first SB driver models v well in a (large)sealed box.
Slightly OT: Didn't know that ACR still exists. That was formerly a Swiss reseller/importer of mostly Fostex products and speaker kits.
When I look at those drivers, some of them look like B&C and others look like Beyma for instance. Do they copy those drivers in Indonesia ? I know that the Chinese do things like that. On Aliexpress you can find lots of shameless copies of European drivers. They do sometimes even have the same type ID as the original !!!
Selamat tinggal
Charles
When I look at those drivers, some of them look like B&C and others look like Beyma for instance. Do they copy those drivers in Indonesia ? I know that the Chinese do things like that. On Aliexpress you can find lots of shameless copies of European drivers. They do sometimes even have the same type ID as the original !!!
Selamat tinggal
Charles
A different ACR
Both these are brands out of the Sinar Baja Electric factory. ACR being more towards the local market while SB Acoustics more international.
I understand Sinar Baja Electric does manufacture OEM for other brand name international speaker companies - so yes, some of the drivers might look familiar
The majority of 12" EconoWave designs use a light cone midbass(Fs=40Hz) with good 1kHz - 2kHz frequency response, ~96db sensitivity, but limited low bass. Maybe -F3 = 45Hz in a 2.5-3cuft ported cabinet. The cone beaming of many musical 12" midbass at 1.2-1.3kHz matches the 90H degree polar of the SEOS waveguides. Controlled directivity.
The SB34NRXL75-8 is a " real-woofer" (Fs=22Hz) with an advanced low Le motor which can support a 1.1-1.2kHz BW3 crossover to a 1" compression driver in ideally the SEOS15, but also usable @1.2kHz with the SEOS12. 91db sensitivity should still rock your room with a good solid state amp. For box estimates, you can use a 4cuft ported cabinet tuned to 28Hz (4" dia, 7.8" long) which produces a modest bass shelf which typically creates a flat SPL after room gain.
You can build a GREAT conventional 3-way with the SB34NRXL75-8, 5.5" midbass(SB17NRX or MW16P or even MW19P), and 1" dome (SB29RDC).
Red Spade audio is just across the pond in Australia, and offers a few kits and discussion forum where you might find local sources for good kits. The HE2 is horn + 12". The synergy diy horn speakers are an excellent diy-education project.
Acoustic Room analysis and Custom Designed speakers Melbourne
Red Spade Audio: DIY point source horn
Red Spade Audio: EOI: DIY point source horn kit
Red Spade Audio PSE-144
If you sketch your room dimensions, you can experiment with different horn polar patterns and best listening(sofa) positions.
The SB34NRXL75-8 is a " real-woofer" (Fs=22Hz) with an advanced low Le motor which can support a 1.1-1.2kHz BW3 crossover to a 1" compression driver in ideally the SEOS15, but also usable @1.2kHz with the SEOS12. 91db sensitivity should still rock your room with a good solid state amp. For box estimates, you can use a 4cuft ported cabinet tuned to 28Hz (4" dia, 7.8" long) which produces a modest bass shelf which typically creates a flat SPL after room gain.
You can build a GREAT conventional 3-way with the SB34NRXL75-8, 5.5" midbass(SB17NRX or MW16P or even MW19P), and 1" dome (SB29RDC).
Red Spade audio is just across the pond in Australia, and offers a few kits and discussion forum where you might find local sources for good kits. The HE2 is horn + 12". The synergy diy horn speakers are an excellent diy-education project.
Acoustic Room analysis and Custom Designed speakers Melbourne
Red Spade Audio: DIY point source horn
Red Spade Audio: EOI: DIY point source horn kit
Red Spade Audio PSE-144
If you sketch your room dimensions, you can experiment with different horn polar patterns and best listening(sofa) positions.
welcome to Indonesia sthcoaster,
I have no experience with ACR woofer, but I have a 9KH ACR tweeter replacing the old philip AD016x tweeter which I think ACR sounds better.
Other Indonesian members may give you information about ACR woofer (so many model)
SB accoustic is still too expensive for some Indonesian (me)
You can try to go to local shop for example in jakarta there is "mangga dua square" (jakarta people please confirm if i am right),
here (bandung) there is "pasar Cikapundung", you will find some other local brand, like "audax", old stock/discontinue "national" (by National Gobel / matsushita panasonic)
I still use the 8" national woofer that I bought 20 years ago
Jual woofer national | Tokopedia
Jual woofer audax | Tokopedia
I have no experience with ACR woofer, but I have a 9KH ACR tweeter replacing the old philip AD016x tweeter which I think ACR sounds better.
Other Indonesian members may give you information about ACR woofer (so many model)
SB accoustic is still too expensive for some Indonesian (me)
You can try to go to local shop for example in jakarta there is "mangga dua square" (jakarta people please confirm if i am right),
here (bandung) there is "pasar Cikapundung", you will find some other local brand, like "audax", old stock/discontinue "national" (by National Gobel / matsushita panasonic)
I still use the 8" national woofer that I bought 20 years ago
Jual woofer national | Tokopedia
Jual woofer audax | Tokopedia
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This is probably a deadpan joke.
...but lots of people are unfamiliar with 'straya, and how far everything here is spread out.
e.g. when Antony and the Johnsons were playing in Melbourne, they / she suggested going to the Great Barrier Reef for the afternoon (and had to be told that the reef looks tropical because it is IN THE TROPICS and is about 2,500km away from Melbourne).
You can fly from London to New York slightly faster than from Melbourne to Jakarta 🙂
For the OP:
a) The first driver you list is in this:
Zaph|Audio - SB12.3 3-Way Tower
Note that Zaph measured a higher Qts than the spec, and I measured higher again when I got some. You might find that the SB woofers (and, I suspect, many other budget/Asian woofers) want a somewhat bigger box than the spec sheet would suggest.
b) Do you think you'll get a measurement mic / any specialist gear?
If you do a ported box, it could be handy if you can do your own measurements and adjust the tuning to suit - particularly if your drivers do not match their specs.
c) I see you've just moved from the UK. Are you still commuting or still shipping stuff to Jakarta? That is: can you consider drivers from other markets?
d) How long since your location and flag matched?
Bringing drivers long haul can be risky. I've been lucky thus far, but sometimes airport scanners flag up large magnets
This brought a smile to my face.
So long that I am unsure of which flag to fly as I am ambidextrous nationality wise, and a tourist in my country of birth.
I thought I might get away with bringing some compression drivers in my checked baggage (it is my wife that has the job posting out here and she will have to go to the mother ship in US at some point so already have a shopping list for delivery to wherever she is staying)
... but carrying a pair of 12" woofers I'll probably pass on that
Thanks LineSource. This is just the sort of help I am needing. I think I need to start with a proven recipe of driver combinations and box sizes etc. as I don't have the equip nor knowledge to experiment. So maybe a project with what's available locally might even be beyond me unless it is a kit. I will keep mulling this over for now.
Thanks for the Zaph Audio link - nice project - not for me at this stage. I'm wanting something that is still relatively portable to pack at the end of a 3 year contract.
Regarding mics and equipment - not thinking that I am going to get into speaker building longterm and like I have written on in response to others kind enough to address my OP I think I need to step back and collect BOM for an established recipe - I know there is less fun in that
The freight is on route but I have opportunities ahead to travel myself (or ask others to pick up) so I am not limited to local but thought I might try to buy local
Selamat sore greenocean,
Thanks for the local tips - yes I am going to have to get myself up to nth Jakarta Glodok area sometime for a good browse (I'll save that for once I've got the kid in school)
I've just started trying to find my way around tokopedia so those links are helpful.
Terima kasih
what attracted me to the econowave design was that I read ir is quite room friendly and plays well without extensive room treatments. As I am surrounded by lots of blank and flat surfaces, some shiny, and window glass (at least covered in sheer curtains) I am not figuring on getting an accurate sound - rather I am aiming for enjoyable without to great a physical presence
Hi,
Since you're talking ( pre-designed ) eWave, I would suggest that you build the EconoWave Standard using the first SB woofer that you listed ( it'll be the closest to the Dayton woofer for which Zilch designed the network ) .
The linked overview is taken from his Flex-Your-PCD-Mettle thread.
Most of the other 12's listed below would need a subwoofer ( to be considered full-range ) .
🙂
Since you're talking ( pre-designed ) eWave, I would suggest that you build the EconoWave Standard using the first SB woofer that you listed ( it'll be the closest to the Dayton woofer for which Zilch designed the network ) .
The linked overview is taken from his Flex-Your-PCD-Mettle thread.
Most of the other 12's listed below would need a subwoofer ( to be considered full-range ) .
🙂
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