Hi everyone,
I'm currently facing a not so complicated problem that has me lost...
Here's the current situation, in my dad's 230SL (1964), there is a old becker europa radio and a central dash mounted speaker. This is the original setup and looks nice and can even be sufficient for listening to the radio while standing still or at very low (quit) speeds.
We were talkin and decided it would be nice to have an ipod conectivity but to have all of this hidden behind the dash so it doesn't change the looks of the car.
I know and can add 13cm speakers behind the kickpanels, that's not the issue.
The idea would be to put a 12v amp with aux input behind the dash, link it to the speaker and add a bluetooth streaming thingy so nothing is apparent and via our iphones we could have nice music to go with the car.
The main issue I have is the amp part, I've only found chinese amps on ebay, amazon & such and I'm not really convinced of their capability. The goal is not to have very loud or hi fidelity but just to play music at a reasonable level while driving.
How hard is it to build a "miniature" amp that could power two speaker at a reasonable level? How much would it cost? Are there already made options I couldn't find?
Thank you for your help
Regards
Sebastien
I'm currently facing a not so complicated problem that has me lost...
Here's the current situation, in my dad's 230SL (1964), there is a old becker europa radio and a central dash mounted speaker. This is the original setup and looks nice and can even be sufficient for listening to the radio while standing still or at very low (quit) speeds.
We were talkin and decided it would be nice to have an ipod conectivity but to have all of this hidden behind the dash so it doesn't change the looks of the car.
I know and can add 13cm speakers behind the kickpanels, that's not the issue.
The idea would be to put a 12v amp with aux input behind the dash, link it to the speaker and add a bluetooth streaming thingy so nothing is apparent and via our iphones we could have nice music to go with the car.
The main issue I have is the amp part, I've only found chinese amps on ebay, amazon & such and I'm not really convinced of their capability. The goal is not to have very loud or hi fidelity but just to play music at a reasonable level while driving.
How hard is it to build a "miniature" amp that could power two speaker at a reasonable level? How much would it cost? Are there already made options I couldn't find?
Thank you for your help
Regards
Sebastien
you might want to check out custom autosound. they make new radios that look like old school stereos. not sure about european models but its worth a look through their website to see if anything would work.
is your car on 12v system now? most cars from that era run a 6v generator charging system.
there are some amps still made in the USA. you dont need anything very powerful for what you want to run. honestly, if I were you, I would install an aftermarket radio in the glove box or in the center console. power the kick panel speakers off that, and you will have the availability to stream bluetooth or use a USB cable. I would also dynamat the vehicle as cars from that era have no sound insulation, which could make it tough to hear the stereo on the highway.
is your car on 12v system now? most cars from that era run a 6v generator charging system.
there are some amps still made in the USA. you dont need anything very powerful for what you want to run. honestly, if I were you, I would install an aftermarket radio in the glove box or in the center console. power the kick panel speakers off that, and you will have the availability to stream bluetooth or use a USB cable. I would also dynamat the vehicle as cars from that era have no sound insulation, which could make it tough to hear the stereo on the highway.
Check out this for some ideas:
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/546879-1971-restoration-porn-ii-ultimate-hidden-stereo.html
I think this might help you get to your goals of connecting everything.
It shouldn't be too hard to find a decent 2 channel amp though. If I may suggest speakers for the kick panels I'd suggest getting some Kef's. They play really well of axis.
http://medleysmusings.com/kef-q100-drive-unit-testing/
(also check out Zaph: Zaph|Audio, he tested the Q100 as well)
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/546879-1971-restoration-porn-ii-ultimate-hidden-stereo.html
I think this might help you get to your goals of connecting everything.
It shouldn't be too hard to find a decent 2 channel amp though. If I may suggest speakers for the kick panels I'd suggest getting some Kef's. They play really well of axis.
http://medleysmusings.com/kef-q100-drive-unit-testing/
(also check out Zaph: Zaph|Audio, he tested the Q100 as well)
Bluetooth audio is lossy - everything is converted to something like MP3 to be transmitted. How about just hiding a 3.5mm jack or cable somewhere? Then mount a volume control behind a knob that blends in with the dash or console. Perhaps use the cigarette lighter location.
A 10 watt/channel T-amp may be enough. That's about the same RMS wattage as all the "high-power" head units that claim 30 or 40 or 50 peak "watts". I'd just have some reservations as to whether the Chinese amps are designed to survive an automotive electrical and physical environment. There are some fairly compact name brand autosound amps. Is underseat or trunk mounting out of the question? Behind the dash tends to be crowded and an uncomfortable place to work.
A 10 watt/channel T-amp may be enough. That's about the same RMS wattage as all the "high-power" head units that claim 30 or 40 or 50 peak "watts". I'd just have some reservations as to whether the Chinese amps are designed to survive an automotive electrical and physical environment. There are some fairly compact name brand autosound amps. Is underseat or trunk mounting out of the question? Behind the dash tends to be crowded and an uncomfortable place to work.
Hi everyone,
Thanks for the replies and sorry for the late answer, I believed the forum would notify me but didn't...
I've checked custom autosound, their head units are more cadillac than mercedes... And the becker europa really looks good in the car, I'll post a picture later.
The glovebox is nowhere deep enough for a radio and there isn't much space under the seat and virtually no access from the front, side or back to acces the radio and there isn't a center console, its quite empty inside... As for the boot it would be an option but there are no opening between the boot and the interior and considering the battery is behind the front grill, the speakers in the kickpannels, it would mean quite a lot of cables...
Behind the dashboard is not practical but there is space,
most of it lost between the firewall and the dashboard.
I thought about the parrot route but with their screens and controls, it wouldn't be discreet and since its a convertible, I like the idea of being able to leave it roof down without anything tempting thiefs...
I've been looking for 2 channel amps but I'm not good with specs and wasn't able to decide what would be needed for my use, they all tend to sell you on subwoofers and extreme power.
As for the speaker, thanks for the advice, I'll check the space beking the kickpannels, the kefs seem quite deep.
I am well aware bluetooth is lossy but considering its a 1964 convertible with a 6 cylinder that sings through a stainless steel exhaust, hi fidelity would be lost anyway... Its more background music than auditorium car for me.
To go a step further in my reflection, I ordered one of thos chinese amps, for 20€ it was a simple way to proof the concept. if it works, I'll look harder in the brand 2 channel amps or look into building my own with quality components.
Still open for ideas since I'm only testing the system to see how much I can hear the music and will not be relying on a chinese 20€ amp for longterm.
Any ideas for a reasonable and compact 2 channel amp that would admit a jack or left/right input and work standalone?
Thanks for the help and links
Sebastien
Thanks for the replies and sorry for the late answer, I believed the forum would notify me but didn't...
I've checked custom autosound, their head units are more cadillac than mercedes... And the becker europa really looks good in the car, I'll post a picture later.
The glovebox is nowhere deep enough for a radio and there isn't much space under the seat and virtually no access from the front, side or back to acces the radio and there isn't a center console, its quite empty inside... As for the boot it would be an option but there are no opening between the boot and the interior and considering the battery is behind the front grill, the speakers in the kickpannels, it would mean quite a lot of cables...
Behind the dashboard is not practical but there is space,
most of it lost between the firewall and the dashboard.
I thought about the parrot route but with their screens and controls, it wouldn't be discreet and since its a convertible, I like the idea of being able to leave it roof down without anything tempting thiefs...
I've been looking for 2 channel amps but I'm not good with specs and wasn't able to decide what would be needed for my use, they all tend to sell you on subwoofers and extreme power.
As for the speaker, thanks for the advice, I'll check the space beking the kickpannels, the kefs seem quite deep.
I am well aware bluetooth is lossy but considering its a 1964 convertible with a 6 cylinder that sings through a stainless steel exhaust, hi fidelity would be lost anyway... Its more background music than auditorium car for me.
To go a step further in my reflection, I ordered one of thos chinese amps, for 20€ it was a simple way to proof the concept. if it works, I'll look harder in the brand 2 channel amps or look into building my own with quality components.
Still open for ideas since I'm only testing the system to see how much I can hear the music and will not be relying on a chinese 20€ amp for longterm.
Any ideas for a reasonable and compact 2 channel amp that would admit a jack or left/right input and work standalone?
Thanks for the help and links
Sebastien
scourtaud,
I had a Mercedes that was newer than you vintage but I know the cars fairly well. I still remember that some of the accessories were mounted in the glove box back then, these would have been Becker eq and stuff like that. I would look and see if you can't hide what you want behind the glovebox liner. that does come out. Mount it to the firewall or somewhere that it stays hidden. I would just leave the Becker where it belongs as nothing else is going to look like that except for some old Blaupunck stereos. Hide it all and use remote control, but you can have all new electronics for not that much if it is just for the radio. You could put everything in the trunk also and run wires up to the front of the car under the carpet. Many ways you can do what you want.
I had a Mercedes that was newer than you vintage but I know the cars fairly well. I still remember that some of the accessories were mounted in the glove box back then, these would have been Becker eq and stuff like that. I would look and see if you can't hide what you want behind the glovebox liner. that does come out. Mount it to the firewall or somewhere that it stays hidden. I would just leave the Becker where it belongs as nothing else is going to look like that except for some old Blaupunck stereos. Hide it all and use remote control, but you can have all new electronics for not that much if it is just for the radio. You could put everything in the trunk also and run wires up to the front of the car under the carpet. Many ways you can do what you want.
What you could also do, I believe (would require some extensive wiring but depending on how dedicated you are, would been hidden for sure) is get a modern head unit that has a detachable face and then hide the body (main chassis) anywhere of your choosing and then make a cable from the back of the face of the headunit to the chassis of the headunit, therefore replicating everything, as if the face was on the headunit. The only thing I would worry about it the power loss (depending on the length of the wire) from the headunit to the face. Granted, it's just an idea but I feel like it would work as long as you don't run the wires from the US to China. I can illustrate this in a picture if you don't get the drift. Again, just an idea.
Hi everyone,
I've recieved the chinese amp and bought a pair of Alpine speakers that were readily avaliable close to home, the choice was quite limited.
I've tested it on my desk, it works quite well even though it is quickly at its limit.
I will try fitting the speakers in the car and try out the amp in situation before commiting to final installation of it. I'm quite sure the chinese amp wont be enough so I'm looking into "real" amps (rockford, alpine, jbl & co) and was wondering if any of you knew if I could simply use the iphone as a source with the right cable?
Regards
Sebastien
I've recieved the chinese amp and bought a pair of Alpine speakers that were readily avaliable close to home, the choice was quite limited.
I've tested it on my desk, it works quite well even though it is quickly at its limit.
I will try fitting the speakers in the car and try out the amp in situation before commiting to final installation of it. I'm quite sure the chinese amp wont be enough so I'm looking into "real" amps (rockford, alpine, jbl & co) and was wondering if any of you knew if I could simply use the iphone as a source with the right cable?
Regards
Sebastien
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