I love the design that the Kef LS60 has.
What do you think about making a copy with other drivers.
A full range driver and 1,2 or 4 bass drivers.
Prefer not to have active speakers but completely ordinary ones.
I want a small baffle and a small full range driver. Max diameter 4-5 inches.
The bas drivers should not be larger than 5-5.5 inches and preferably go deep.
Feel free to receive tips on suitable FR and Bass drivers.
Thanks.
What do you think about making a copy with other drivers.
A full range driver and 1,2 or 4 bass drivers.
Prefer not to have active speakers but completely ordinary ones.
I want a small baffle and a small full range driver. Max diameter 4-5 inches.
The bas drivers should not be larger than 5-5.5 inches and preferably go deep.
Feel free to receive tips on suitable FR and Bass drivers.
Thanks.
Doesn't seem to be much of a clone if you drop the most distinctive features of the speaker namely the coaxial driver and the shift to wireless DSP active crossover plus related electronics. If you use 1 or 2 side woofers rather than 4 what would be left? Not intending to bash what could be a fun project just that the source of inspiration seems rather distant.
A few years back I briefly worked on a similarish design for a KEF coaxial with 4 small woofers. Some of my issues were adequately stiffening the woofer cabinets due to a low frequency "nodding" mode if the central midrange cabinet was passively isolated and ways to adequately connect opposite magnets to force cancel. Could have probably worked it through but ended up shelving the design. Perhaps I ought to get back to it.
A few years back I briefly worked on a similarish design for a KEF coaxial with 4 small woofers. Some of my issues were adequately stiffening the woofer cabinets due to a low frequency "nodding" mode if the central midrange cabinet was passively isolated and ways to adequately connect opposite magnets to force cancel. Could have probably worked it through but ended up shelving the design. Perhaps I ought to get back to it.
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Instead of using a full range driver at center, use the SICA 5" coax driver. Its not expensive and is being used in a fairly high end speaker by SIgberg Audio with measurements shown on ASR
This is certainly doable Leif.
A FR as midTweeter makes a whole lot of sense, no XO thru the critical midband, and the real possibility of having all the drivers within a quarter wave-length of each other minimizes the sonic degradation that an XO brings with it. Can also be much more budget friendly.
I have given much thot to this configuration, i beat KEF to push-push before they released the 104ab but they did show that mirroring the push-psuh woofers seems just obvious. With Blade as inspiration, and wanting to try some other experiments, we used the superb performance of this WAW to come up with the monstrosoty we call The Facets. Scott and i had to jump thru hoops to get the Zd such that we could place the midTweeter in the right place.
When i first saw LS60 it was obvious that adding an extra pair of woofers to Tysen would be a brain-dead easy way to create something very simialr. The W14 woofers come in 4/8/16Ω so getting a configuration that works with the existing passive XO as well as active.
Getting the woofers outside NA is somewhat of an issue. But the combo can be realized for very little outlay, and the woofer scan be reflex loaded in 5-15 litres or in Tysen's ML-TL, giving them an F10 about 35 Hz anechoic.
If one goes active, one gets considearbly more versatility. Pick you favorite FR/coax (coax needs DSP to deal with the quarter wave timing issue, and choice is limited [but growing]). Coax is going to be a more expensive (possibly considerably more) and IME can easily be surpassed by a good FR.
There are a zillion ways one can approach this.
dave
A FR as midTweeter makes a whole lot of sense, no XO thru the critical midband, and the real possibility of having all the drivers within a quarter wave-length of each other minimizes the sonic degradation that an XO brings with it. Can also be much more budget friendly.
I have given much thot to this configuration, i beat KEF to push-push before they released the 104ab but they did show that mirroring the push-psuh woofers seems just obvious. With Blade as inspiration, and wanting to try some other experiments, we used the superb performance of this WAW to come up with the monstrosoty we call The Facets. Scott and i had to jump thru hoops to get the Zd such that we could place the midTweeter in the right place.
When i first saw LS60 it was obvious that adding an extra pair of woofers to Tysen would be a brain-dead easy way to create something very simialr. The W14 woofers come in 4/8/16Ω so getting a configuration that works with the existing passive XO as well as active.
Getting the woofers outside NA is somewhat of an issue. But the combo can be realized for very little outlay, and the woofer scan be reflex loaded in 5-15 litres or in Tysen's ML-TL, giving them an F10 about 35 Hz anechoic.
If one goes active, one gets considearbly more versatility. Pick you favorite FR/coax (coax needs DSP to deal with the quarter wave timing issue, and choice is limited [but growing]). Coax is going to be a more expensive (possibly considerably more) and IME can easily be surpassed by a good FR.
There are a zillion ways one can approach this.
dave
Your favourite Alpair or possible a Jordan or a 10f/8424 plus four of the new Dayton 5” Epique subwoofers would be an interesting combination (but not cheap in Europe). Or maybe 2 of the SB 10” low profile subs back to back (for a similar price), this can get down to the low 30’s f3 with just 16l each but they do need a 7.5cm x 95cm vent so PR May be the way to do.
https://sbacoustics.com/product/10in-sw26dbac76-8/
https://sbacoustics.com/product/10in-sw26dbac76-8/
I hadn’t looked at that one, i did the larger W6. It is grossly insenstive but does go low, i am getting sims in 10 litre miniOnken that reach below 30 Hz F10.
Having measured many sets of TB by big worry is there QC, as it seems you would need to buy a few more than needed to get a matched set of bass drivers.
But there are so so many choices & combinations depending on how big a box you can live with.
This is just a WAW with a balanced, symetrical composite woofer. And a coax to complicate things. Like WAW there is a whole wide world of new designs that can be explored.
dave
I have an easy project. Take a JBL530. Place it on top of a tall box with 4 or even 8 side firing woofers. Cross over around 250Hz.
Rework the crossover or make the bass only handle below 100Hz like a sub.
Rework the crossover or make the bass only handle below 100Hz like a sub.
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and 2 8"side firing woofers 2.5 ways S-Harch x-over ..... for cheap !
Another option is the SB Acoustics 6in coaxial and 5in coaxial. Also SEAS is an option for coaxial as well.
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A ProAc Response 2.5 when released in 2005 was US$4500. By today inflation that’s about US$6800.
the ProAc was a clonable 2 way box speaker using off-the-shelf drivers.
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/proac-response-2-5-one-cloners-journey.11963/
to clone the KEF LS60 is nigh impossible.
You could build a LS60 inspired passive speaker.
or for US$7000; just charge it to your credit card,
It comes complete with amps and DACs and DSP and streaming audio. plug it in, listen to it on your own room; and id you don’t like it better than what you already have, return it within 30 days get a refund if you don’t like it.
Wow, modern life just keeps getting better than better.
the ProAc was a clonable 2 way box speaker using off-the-shelf drivers.
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/proac-response-2-5-one-cloners-journey.11963/
to clone the KEF LS60 is nigh impossible.
You could build a LS60 inspired passive speaker.
or for US$7000; just charge it to your credit card,
It comes complete with amps and DACs and DSP and streaming audio. plug it in, listen to it on your own room; and id you don’t like it better than what you already have, return it within 30 days get a refund if you don’t like it.
Wow, modern life just keeps getting better than better.
JBL 530’s are very nice. A steal at $220/pair.
I have a thread on them here.
I was thinking of modifying them to be synergy like but you know what, they sound pretty darn good stock - with 5ohms extra padding on tweeter. Easy since bi-ampable with dual binding posts standard.
That waveguide is very nice. The crossover is quite complicated and I am surprised they went to such great lengths for a budget speaker. It had like 18 components! (Which sort of means the drivers were not the most well behaved?)
The crossover alone seems to indicate that this was meant to be a true studio monitor in the $600+ range.