For about 10 years now I've owned a Luxman PD121 turntable, which I've never gotten to a point that I feel it's performing to it's potential, and every time I've tried to get somewhere with it, I end up poorer and disappointed.
The turntable came to me with a problematic Denon tonearm on it that is way to loosey goosey and not a good match for the cartridge I already had that I've also not had much luck in pairing with something to make it live up to it's potential, an Ortofon Rondo Bronze.
So, that leaves me looking for a solution to replace the tonearm that will pair nicely with the Luxman turntable and Ortofon cartridge.
I turned to Ortofon customer support for advice, figuring they would have a better idea of what would pair nicely with their cartridge. Their support recommended an SME 3009 tonearm as an option that would pair nicely with the cartridge, and a "most recommended" tonearm upgrade for the luxman turntable. So I picked one up. I'm quite unhappy with this recommendation.
The luxman turntable comes with a metal/plastic puck with slot that is easily removed and inserted into the base, to install a tonearm. I downloaded and checked all documentation I could find on the luxman turntable to see if that would offer any useful information on what tonearms to pair with it - it doesn't. Only gives information as to how to remove/insert the puck - no recommendations or information at all whatsoever on what to pair with it, or how, or how to go about finding a decent pairing. I suppose back in the day that was left to the dealers to deal with. Anyways, what I was expecting was a tonearm similar to how the denon works - a threaded tube that fits through the slot, with a nut to tighten from underneath. What I received is a tonearm that comes with a metal plate with 4 tiny wood screws, and a tool to determine the proper point on a wooden base to drill holes, and secure the metal plate with the wood screws. Mind you, I did do some research before making this purchase, which was recommended by Ortofon. And I have found multiple examples online, with pictures, of Luxman PD121 turntables with SME 3009 tonearms on them. It appears they're screwed in, as designed.....into the metal/plastic puck.
I knew enough to not expect a wood screw to easily go into my turntable base, so I carefully laid out where the plate would go, marked points with marker, got my drill, and drilled some pilot holes for the screws to go into. And I then carefully attempted to screw the plate to the puck, and carefully broke the heads off of 3 of the 4 screws in the process.
I then went to the hardware store, picked up an assortment of 3 different types of screws, and tried again - as there was wiggle room to slide the plate over and try again where I didn't have holes plugged up with broken screws. And on the 3rd type of screw I tried, I finally ran into success.
This is not at all what I had in mind for tonearm installation, so I'm a bit pissed at Ortofon for recommending a tonearm that is clearly not designed for my turntable, despite it having been installed by some in the past. But...after throwing money at one, one is motivated to make it work.
So, the tonearm does come with 2 different counterweights. This was important, as counterweight weight was an issue in the past. The Ortofon cartridge was clearly heavier than the Denon tonearm I had was designed for, and I had to add extra weight to the counterweight on that arm to make it work - which was, in my mind, a half assed modification to use it outside of it's designed spec that would prevent me from achieving the full potential of the products. This was a big reason I was on this path of a new way to half *** something into working. So, I put the big counterweight on, put the cartridge on, let the arm loose, and it flew into the air. Even with the heavy counterweight screwed all the way in. Clearly, this weight is too heavy for my Ortofon cartridge. Then, I go to the smaller weight. Attach it, and the tonearm is always weighed down by the cartridge, even when the weight is as far out as I can make it. It seems my cartridge is in a no mans land of too heavy for the small weight, too light for the big weight. I went looking on ebay for SME counterweights, and found plenty of examples of those 2 sizes sold by themselves, no example of another sized weight in the middle.
As upset as I am at Ortofon recommending a tonearm that doesn't exactly pair nicely or easily to my turntable, at least that's a little understandable....but for them to recommend a tonearm that clearly doesn't pair at all with their product, is just beyond excusable. I'm beyond pissed at Ortofon support at this point.
Meanwhile, I do have a signet cartridge that is much lighter than the Ortofon cartridge. So I decided to see if I can at least get that working with this. And I found once I got that balanced, even with the tonearm lift in the down position, the needle hovers over the surface! Ugh!
It does seem as though the piece that contains the lift can be adjusted down, although it requires a tiny star screwdriver to loosen the adjustment screw. But yet another sign that things are just not paired right.
I'm a bit frustrated as this isn't the first time I've looked for advice or help in turntable setup, and it seems while there are plenty of people that will speak to the importance of researching these things, and pairing things properly, to find that synergy among the equipment, no one seems to be able to give any specifics as to just how to do that! I've made great efforts to research these things, ask around, ask the professionals, find the documentation out there, download it, make what I think are informed decisions....and I end up throwing good money away on equipment that doesn't pair at all. It's beyond frustrating.
A piece of advice that's sometimes thrown out there is to sell it off and buy something else. But that's advice along the lines of, well, if you don't want to do it, if you can't handle it, if you aren't capable... That's not exactly the case here. I'm willing to put in the needed effort. This is a decent turntable, it should be able to be brought up to spec and made to work. If it sell it off, then I'll just end up with another turntable that will inevitably need maintenance at some point, it's not like I'm not going to need to figure out how to maintain my equipment at some point.
I feel like - the world is just filled with people that have little useful advice beyond vague suggestions, and the knowledge I"m looking to get is just being lost by a generation that is disappearing. And I don't want to let that happen. Someone needs to keep these turntables going, I'd like to at least keep mine going for as long as I need it.
So....that's my story, that's my current situation. I'm awaiting tiny star screwdrivers to try and further adjust the tone arm. Although I'm still out of luck for the weight issue with the Ortofon cartridge.
Is there anyone here that can offer some real solid advice or suggestions here? I'd like to get this turntable up to spec, and the Ortofon cartridge in use to live to it's potential. How should I go about doing that?
The turntable came to me with a problematic Denon tonearm on it that is way to loosey goosey and not a good match for the cartridge I already had that I've also not had much luck in pairing with something to make it live up to it's potential, an Ortofon Rondo Bronze.
So, that leaves me looking for a solution to replace the tonearm that will pair nicely with the Luxman turntable and Ortofon cartridge.
I turned to Ortofon customer support for advice, figuring they would have a better idea of what would pair nicely with their cartridge. Their support recommended an SME 3009 tonearm as an option that would pair nicely with the cartridge, and a "most recommended" tonearm upgrade for the luxman turntable. So I picked one up. I'm quite unhappy with this recommendation.
The luxman turntable comes with a metal/plastic puck with slot that is easily removed and inserted into the base, to install a tonearm. I downloaded and checked all documentation I could find on the luxman turntable to see if that would offer any useful information on what tonearms to pair with it - it doesn't. Only gives information as to how to remove/insert the puck - no recommendations or information at all whatsoever on what to pair with it, or how, or how to go about finding a decent pairing. I suppose back in the day that was left to the dealers to deal with. Anyways, what I was expecting was a tonearm similar to how the denon works - a threaded tube that fits through the slot, with a nut to tighten from underneath. What I received is a tonearm that comes with a metal plate with 4 tiny wood screws, and a tool to determine the proper point on a wooden base to drill holes, and secure the metal plate with the wood screws. Mind you, I did do some research before making this purchase, which was recommended by Ortofon. And I have found multiple examples online, with pictures, of Luxman PD121 turntables with SME 3009 tonearms on them. It appears they're screwed in, as designed.....into the metal/plastic puck.
I knew enough to not expect a wood screw to easily go into my turntable base, so I carefully laid out where the plate would go, marked points with marker, got my drill, and drilled some pilot holes for the screws to go into. And I then carefully attempted to screw the plate to the puck, and carefully broke the heads off of 3 of the 4 screws in the process.
I then went to the hardware store, picked up an assortment of 3 different types of screws, and tried again - as there was wiggle room to slide the plate over and try again where I didn't have holes plugged up with broken screws. And on the 3rd type of screw I tried, I finally ran into success.
This is not at all what I had in mind for tonearm installation, so I'm a bit pissed at Ortofon for recommending a tonearm that is clearly not designed for my turntable, despite it having been installed by some in the past. But...after throwing money at one, one is motivated to make it work.
So, the tonearm does come with 2 different counterweights. This was important, as counterweight weight was an issue in the past. The Ortofon cartridge was clearly heavier than the Denon tonearm I had was designed for, and I had to add extra weight to the counterweight on that arm to make it work - which was, in my mind, a half assed modification to use it outside of it's designed spec that would prevent me from achieving the full potential of the products. This was a big reason I was on this path of a new way to half *** something into working. So, I put the big counterweight on, put the cartridge on, let the arm loose, and it flew into the air. Even with the heavy counterweight screwed all the way in. Clearly, this weight is too heavy for my Ortofon cartridge. Then, I go to the smaller weight. Attach it, and the tonearm is always weighed down by the cartridge, even when the weight is as far out as I can make it. It seems my cartridge is in a no mans land of too heavy for the small weight, too light for the big weight. I went looking on ebay for SME counterweights, and found plenty of examples of those 2 sizes sold by themselves, no example of another sized weight in the middle.
As upset as I am at Ortofon recommending a tonearm that doesn't exactly pair nicely or easily to my turntable, at least that's a little understandable....but for them to recommend a tonearm that clearly doesn't pair at all with their product, is just beyond excusable. I'm beyond pissed at Ortofon support at this point.
Meanwhile, I do have a signet cartridge that is much lighter than the Ortofon cartridge. So I decided to see if I can at least get that working with this. And I found once I got that balanced, even with the tonearm lift in the down position, the needle hovers over the surface! Ugh!
It does seem as though the piece that contains the lift can be adjusted down, although it requires a tiny star screwdriver to loosen the adjustment screw. But yet another sign that things are just not paired right.
I'm a bit frustrated as this isn't the first time I've looked for advice or help in turntable setup, and it seems while there are plenty of people that will speak to the importance of researching these things, and pairing things properly, to find that synergy among the equipment, no one seems to be able to give any specifics as to just how to do that! I've made great efforts to research these things, ask around, ask the professionals, find the documentation out there, download it, make what I think are informed decisions....and I end up throwing good money away on equipment that doesn't pair at all. It's beyond frustrating.
A piece of advice that's sometimes thrown out there is to sell it off and buy something else. But that's advice along the lines of, well, if you don't want to do it, if you can't handle it, if you aren't capable... That's not exactly the case here. I'm willing to put in the needed effort. This is a decent turntable, it should be able to be brought up to spec and made to work. If it sell it off, then I'll just end up with another turntable that will inevitably need maintenance at some point, it's not like I'm not going to need to figure out how to maintain my equipment at some point.
I feel like - the world is just filled with people that have little useful advice beyond vague suggestions, and the knowledge I"m looking to get is just being lost by a generation that is disappearing. And I don't want to let that happen. Someone needs to keep these turntables going, I'd like to at least keep mine going for as long as I need it.
So....that's my story, that's my current situation. I'm awaiting tiny star screwdrivers to try and further adjust the tone arm. Although I'm still out of luck for the weight issue with the Ortofon cartridge.
Is there anyone here that can offer some real solid advice or suggestions here? I'd like to get this turntable up to spec, and the Ortofon cartridge in use to live to it's potential. How should I go about doing that?
The SME arm was used by Luxman for the same reason the earliest Linn Sondek used it --it was popular then --Linn moved on ---quickly .
In the UK the SME arm fell out of favor in that design after trying a longer arm they came out with a more heavyweight later arm .
Like you I am not at all impressed with the advice given, I owned two SME arms and sorry I was not inspired to continue using them -- the UK "Golden Ears " also --shall we say-- "moved on " in their advice on it.
It seems the advice given is --well it was approved way back then and is given by young guys who didn't live through that era or were too young at the time .
I am not saying its a "bad arm " what I am saying is its an out of date design bettered by many later arms when newer audio top end test equipment was used to determine resonances etc to a higher level.
Even SME admitted ( at the time ) their newer/dearer more conventional arms outclassed it.
Your deck is pretty good not top end but it will reproduce --music if given the right tools.
In the UK the SME arm fell out of favor in that design after trying a longer arm they came out with a more heavyweight later arm .
Like you I am not at all impressed with the advice given, I owned two SME arms and sorry I was not inspired to continue using them -- the UK "Golden Ears " also --shall we say-- "moved on " in their advice on it.
It seems the advice given is --well it was approved way back then and is given by young guys who didn't live through that era or were too young at the time .
I am not saying its a "bad arm " what I am saying is its an out of date design bettered by many later arms when newer audio top end test equipment was used to determine resonances etc to a higher level.
Even SME admitted ( at the time ) their newer/dearer more conventional arms outclassed it.
Your deck is pretty good not top end but it will reproduce --music if given the right tools.
OK, seems my mistake was not coming here first.
If I look at the option of selling off the SME I bought and rethinking my tonearm options, what would you recommend?
If I look at the option of selling off the SME I bought and rethinking my tonearm options, what would you recommend?
I have found the comment I was talking about as regards the "professionals" opinion of the SME3009 and I quote-
"Once state of the art but long since bettered . Musical enough , but weak at frequency extremes and veiled in the mid-band .
Legendary service has made it a cult , used prices unjustifiably high.
I would have said one of the Rega arms as I use them but your cartridge is near the top weight for them .The Mitchell Tecnoarm will take its weight okay and gets a "near transparent sound with plenty of power and poise".
Also Origin Live tonearms ( but dear ) and Alphason HR100S--I take it its older second hand arms you are looking for so as to save money or do you want right up to date ones ?
"Once state of the art but long since bettered . Musical enough , but weak at frequency extremes and veiled in the mid-band .
Legendary service has made it a cult , used prices unjustifiably high.
I would have said one of the Rega arms as I use them but your cartridge is near the top weight for them .The Mitchell Tecnoarm will take its weight okay and gets a "near transparent sound with plenty of power and poise".
Also Origin Live tonearms ( but dear ) and Alphason HR100S--I take it its older second hand arms you are looking for so as to save money or do you want right up to date ones ?
These are some good starting points.
At this point, I've progressed further with the SME arm, and have gotten to a point that with a little more adjusting and fine tuning, I should be able to make it work. I figured out that the 2 counterweights it came with seem to have included 1 that originally came with it at 110g, which is too light, and a 180g that was probably purchased separately by the previous owner to match it with a heavier cartridge. I was informed there were also 130g counterweights made for the arm, which seems to be what my cartridge requires. I happened to have a bit of copper pipe that fit over the 110g weight to bring that up to 130g, and sure enough, things are balancing.
May as well see this through for now.
But these arm suggestions are things I will investigate further, as I'm sure I will never be done upgrading. After all, the chase for perfection is a neverending one.
Thanks so much for your feedback here.
At this point, I've progressed further with the SME arm, and have gotten to a point that with a little more adjusting and fine tuning, I should be able to make it work. I figured out that the 2 counterweights it came with seem to have included 1 that originally came with it at 110g, which is too light, and a 180g that was probably purchased separately by the previous owner to match it with a heavier cartridge. I was informed there were also 130g counterweights made for the arm, which seems to be what my cartridge requires. I happened to have a bit of copper pipe that fit over the 110g weight to bring that up to 130g, and sure enough, things are balancing.
May as well see this through for now.
But these arm suggestions are things I will investigate further, as I'm sure I will never be done upgrading. After all, the chase for perfection is a neverending one.
Thanks so much for your feedback here.
Ok, I've decided to go in a bit of a different direction here. The SME arm I picked up on eBay ended up having some problems that resulted in a return, so that's off the table. The Denon arm that was on the Luxman table has been determined to have serious bearing problems, and is probably not worth dealing with at all.
After reviewing options, I decided the best thing to do with my Ortofon Rondo Bronze cartridge would be to put it on a new turntable.
Meanwhile, I now have a Luxman PD-121 with no arm, and no plans.
I also have a Signet TKN7Su cartridge that I use for CD4 vinyl playback.
Any recommendations on a good arm that would easily fit the Luxman and pair nicely with the Signet?
After reviewing options, I decided the best thing to do with my Ortofon Rondo Bronze cartridge would be to put it on a new turntable.
Meanwhile, I now have a Luxman PD-121 with no arm, and no plans.
I also have a Signet TKN7Su cartridge that I use for CD4 vinyl playback.
Any recommendations on a good arm that would easily fit the Luxman and pair nicely with the Signet?
Sorry - I got the model number of the cartridge wrong - it's a TK7Su. I was thinking of the stylus - the stylus starts with TKN, but there's no N in the cartridge model.