Hello,
I'm currently designing my first speaker built or new HT, but I have a difficulty to select a mid range driver which is able to sustain good flat response between 400Mhz - 4kHZ. Re tweeter I'm homing for Vifa xt25bg60 which seems to have a good response. And for the woofers I'm considering Epique E150HE-44 5-1/2"
The idea is to build a 3 way tower speakers and a center speaker LCR.
Any suggestions for good mid range?
I'm currently designing my first speaker built or new HT, but I have a difficulty to select a mid range driver which is able to sustain good flat response between 400Mhz - 4kHZ. Re tweeter I'm homing for Vifa xt25bg60 which seems to have a good response. And for the woofers I'm considering Epique E150HE-44 5-1/2"
The idea is to build a 3 way tower speakers and a center speaker LCR.
Any suggestions for good mid range?
The Epique E150HE-44 isn't very efficient, at 83dB, my instinct is to go for for something in the 87-90dB range, unless you intend to use two per cabinet. For the mid, consider a full range driver, such as the Tymphany TG9FD
The Epiques imho are expensive and only useful in small enclosures. Look for somewhat bigger drivers with about the same Vd (Xmax x Sd). Saves you some money to be spent on good midranges. Or, do you have access to measuring equipment? If not, put your savings in a decent microphone and audio interface.
If you want a detailed speaker then SB23CAC will go in a 1cuft sealed (or two in double the volume) and then a SB15CAC mid and if you want to go the whole hog add the SB26CDC tweeter.
@TS, how much experience do you have on designing loudspeaker systems, including the crossover design?
Thanks for the update, Size should be an issue as I started to build these for a dedicated home cinema. This is my first build and basically I'm lost in the amount of info that i've read. So currently i'm the drivers selection. I would like the LR to be full range to able to handle good dialogue and music tracks. Then I would like the center to be extremely good in dialogue. My confusion is that I've seen a lot of builds and drivers combinations.
Size isn't an issue, but i wasn't thinking to have drivers larger then 7".
This is my first built and I've been for the last 3 months reading and researching. But now its time to get my hand dirty. I've just bought a calibrated mic to help me in my build but that's it till now. I've seen all kinds of speaker combination and this is confusing me. I came across a good number of reviews with regards to cheaper drivers with high recommendations but the more I read the more it gets confusing. Thats why now I decided to use this lovely forum to maybe get some more insights.
😕😕😕😕
After the drivers selection then comes the crossover design. From what I've researched its useless having good drivers with a bad crossover design and enclosure built.
That is 100 percent true. With the mic you’ll be able to get the necessary data for simulations in VituixCAD, BoxSim or whatever you like. My advice would be: go practice on either of these simulation apps. BoxSim has a lot of Visaton drivers ‘preloaded’ so you can design real systems.
Next step is to get acquainted with measuring. You will have to learn to acquire both impedance and sound level measurements of speaker drivers in their enclosure. Use ARTA or REW or whatever you like. Invest in that too, it will help you later on.
Next step is to get acquainted with measuring. You will have to learn to acquire both impedance and sound level measurements of speaker drivers in their enclosure. Use ARTA or REW or whatever you like. Invest in that too, it will help you later on.
tet024 - welcome to a rewarding and satisfying hobby - designing, experimenting, and building speakers. As long as you keep in mind that this is not a "one and done" kind of thing. Your first design will be a learning experiance, and if you are careful and smart, it will sound pretty good. But each subsequent design will potentially be much better.
If you want to simply build something that sounds great and be finished, then you sould seriously consider building a kit. Many good ones are available.
That is a good insight. In general, the design process and the execution of the build is more important than the selection of parts that goes into it. You can find many DIY and commercial designs with inexpensive ordinary parts but which were skillfully integrated together to make a very nice sounding speaker. On the other hand, You will never find a great sounding speaker which consists of high end parts which were poorly integrated with a flawed crossover design and sloppy construction. This kind of thing is unfortunately common - an expensive, but bad-sounding waste of time... 🙁
What is your expected budget? A 3-way with $200 of drivers per side is one thing, but $800 per side is something else. It is not clear from your statements if you have a maximum size limit.
Do you have a technical background? Do you have a general understanding of concepts like impedance, inductance, voltage, phase angle, frequency, wavelength, the decibel, logarithms?
Again - welcome !
j.
If you want to simply build something that sounds great and be finished, then you sould seriously consider building a kit. Many good ones are available.
That is a good insight. In general, the design process and the execution of the build is more important than the selection of parts that goes into it. You can find many DIY and commercial designs with inexpensive ordinary parts but which were skillfully integrated together to make a very nice sounding speaker. On the other hand, You will never find a great sounding speaker which consists of high end parts which were poorly integrated with a flawed crossover design and sloppy construction. This kind of thing is unfortunately common - an expensive, but bad-sounding waste of time... 🙁
What is your expected budget? A 3-way with $200 of drivers per side is one thing, but $800 per side is something else. It is not clear from your statements if you have a maximum size limit.
Do you have a technical background? Do you have a general understanding of concepts like impedance, inductance, voltage, phase angle, frequency, wavelength, the decibel, logarithms?
Again - welcome !
j.
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Hello,
Thanks, Yes I already used REW and the MIC with MINIDSP HD to calibrate my SVS's woofers and had fun playing around with that. I've already played abit the the software even seen some complex 6th order bandpass boxes. But things got ultra complicated 🙂.
Any suggestions on how to best select divers ? As at this point i need i would like to home on drivers.
My First Idea was to go for a good ribbon speaker as i currently have monitor audio Gold GX and the ribbon tweeter is smooth and it could go up to good 60 kHz. But when i did some research I wasn't able to find something similar. The only driver which seems to get good comparable reviews is the VIFA XT25BG60. Then with regards to the other divers I'm abit lost. First i was homing on the W8-2096 but it seems that they aren't available to purchase. I reside in EU and wasn't able to find anywhere. Thus now I'm abit lost in the wide choice available as i can't find a driver which is close to the W8-2096.
At this point recommendations and help would be highly appreciated.
Thanks, Yes I already used REW and the MIC with MINIDSP HD to calibrate my SVS's woofers and had fun playing around with that. I've already played abit the the software even seen some complex 6th order bandpass boxes. But things got ultra complicated 🙂.
Any suggestions on how to best select divers ? As at this point i need i would like to home on drivers.
My First Idea was to go for a good ribbon speaker as i currently have monitor audio Gold GX and the ribbon tweeter is smooth and it could go up to good 60 kHz. But when i did some research I wasn't able to find something similar. The only driver which seems to get good comparable reviews is the VIFA XT25BG60. Then with regards to the other divers I'm abit lost. First i was homing on the W8-2096 but it seems that they aren't available to purchase. I reside in EU and wasn't able to find anywhere. Thus now I'm abit lost in the wide choice available as i can't find a driver which is close to the W8-2096.
At this point recommendations and help would be highly appreciated.
The Peerless NE149W would be a good option. These are getting harder to source now, so I wouldn't wait too long to decide.
You have a lot of options, ‘even’ in the EU. But the exact brand and model don’t matter that much. What matters is the way you succeed to integrate the mid and high in a way that the dispersion of the system doesn’t show big irregularities with changing frequency. That in turn means you have to know how the drivers you selected will behave in the enclosure you designed.
The obvious brands offer very good midranges. Think of SB, Scan Speak, Seas, Peerless, but also of the more ‘pro’ brands like FaitalPro, 18sound and so on. All of these brands have offerings that will match your tweeter more or less. In general I’d say: pick a smaller driver (4-5,5”)if you plan to use the bare tweeter, if you are going to use some kind of waveguide, choose a bigger driver (6,5” and up)
The obvious brands offer very good midranges. Think of SB, Scan Speak, Seas, Peerless, but also of the more ‘pro’ brands like FaitalPro, 18sound and so on. All of these brands have offerings that will match your tweeter more or less. In general I’d say: pick a smaller driver (4-5,5”)if you plan to use the bare tweeter, if you are going to use some kind of waveguide, choose a bigger driver (6,5” and up)
Re:'What would you suggest instead': 5" drivers are really only good for nearfield speakers. For HT, you need something larger, I'd suggest an 8" driver min. It depends on your budget and what's available to you, whether you need baffle step correction and the size of your room.
e.g. 8" SB20PFC woofer + SB15MFC 5" mid + tweeter of your choice, crossed over at your baffle step freq. & ~ 4KHz, would be a reasonable and efficient budget system.
e.g. 8" SB20PFC woofer + SB15MFC 5" mid + tweeter of your choice, crossed over at your baffle step freq. & ~ 4KHz, would be a reasonable and efficient budget system.
Well it is good to know you have some technical understanding... that is a good start.
Normally I begin a 3-way design by selecting some woofer options. Only if i have a particular midrange that I want to use do I start with the midrange.
I decide how big I want the cabinet to be, and how much bass extension I want, meaning what is the F9 point. Let's say I want a 40 liter box, and I want the response to be -9 dB at 32 Hz (the F9 point). Then I look at woofer options that will meet that criteria.
You should start by deciding (1) how big of a box do you want, and (2) how low does it need to go. Tools like WinSD or VituixCad can help.
Normally I begin a 3-way design by selecting some woofer options. Only if i have a particular midrange that I want to use do I start with the midrange.
I decide how big I want the cabinet to be, and how much bass extension I want, meaning what is the F9 point. Let's say I want a 40 liter box, and I want the response to be -9 dB at 32 Hz (the F9 point). Then I look at woofer options that will meet that criteria.
You should start by deciding (1) how big of a box do you want, and (2) how low does it need to go. Tools like WinSD or VituixCad can help.
On the woofers it’s not that hard. Small driver plus low frequency cutoff equals low efficiency. Certainly with large overhung coils with lots of Xmax. Compare the Daytons with TB W6-1139 or Peerless SLS6. Two of them do serious work at low frequencies. The TB W69 fits in a slim enclosure but has more Vd and more efficiency. If you would consider 8”, the possibilities widen further. But that is not to say those new Daytons should be ignored. Over here they are just somewhat expensive.
Hello,
Thanks for the reply ... I need to calculate box side but i think i shall be homing on a 7" or 8" woofer but you know ... its never low enough 🙂 32hz i think would be a good compromise so not increase the box size alot. Still drivers its confusing how to select. The more YouTube reviews i see and the more i research the more get confusing... The idea is to have a driver with good xmax so the excursion should be a good one to have better air displacement.
In your personal option how is it best to tackle this ? At this point I've stopped reading and watching videos as its more confusing. Sometimes too much of info is bad especially for someone who is just starting in the DIY world. Target is that for the Holiday Season I would Have the LCR replaced with something good and DIY. I already purchased 2 amps (2 x NU1000DSP) to drive the front channels. Target is to have something within this range (2 x 500 Watts into 2 Ohms or 2 x 300 Watts into 4 Ohms) I think having a 2ohm setup is too much. So 300watts into 4 ohms seems more reasonable.
Don’t get confused on driver choices. A competent designer can and will design very good systems with B or even C choices for drivers. Home in on the enclosure instead, on baffle sizes, on chamfers and other acoustical relevant details. Don’t forget the aesthetical part, you will be looking at them and that does trickery to sound quality too.
Essentially any 7 to 8” will do fine in an enclosure of about 25 to 50 liters for a BR design. A Vd of about 150cm3 combined with a good BR tuning will provide enough capacity for normal to moderate loud listening and adequate low frequency reproduction. For earthquake sound levels you need (much) more. Define your goals in these parameters (desired SPL and frequency range, sound quality, design), not in which driver to pick. And please realize that the room and placement of your speakers do make out more than 70 percent of the sound quality of low frequencies.
Essentially any 7 to 8” will do fine in an enclosure of about 25 to 50 liters for a BR design. A Vd of about 150cm3 combined with a good BR tuning will provide enough capacity for normal to moderate loud listening and adequate low frequency reproduction. For earthquake sound levels you need (much) more. Define your goals in these parameters (desired SPL and frequency range, sound quality, design), not in which driver to pick. And please realize that the room and placement of your speakers do make out more than 70 percent of the sound quality of low frequencies.