If I was going to research the equipment I need to make a spider and basket, what keywords would I use for the machinery involved in creating them?
The typical speaker is a stamped metal basket. Sheet metal stamped out in a big press with tool and die. Some heftier speakers have cast metal baskets, I assume you are not going there. So while I am not a machinist, if I had to think of a term, I'd use "die press."
I don't know what all goes into the spider material, but I'd assume it was pressed out in a mold. They seem to be a coarse fabric impregnated with something. perhaps heating it for pliability then pressing? Beats me.
Juan Fahey, who posts here often manufactures speakers, and will probably have a better answer. In the mean time, you might ask the folks at Eminence, they have been open and helpful when I asked them odd technical questions in the past.
You looking to make one, or go into business?
I don't know what all goes into the spider material, but I'd assume it was pressed out in a mold. They seem to be a coarse fabric impregnated with something. perhaps heating it for pliability then pressing? Beats me.
Juan Fahey, who posts here often manufactures speakers, and will probably have a better answer. In the mean time, you might ask the folks at Eminence, they have been open and helpful when I asked them odd technical questions in the past.
You looking to make one, or go into business?
Just to make them and use them in my home. If they sound good maybe they will make nice presents 🙂 I looked at eminence, but I am not a business. How did you ask eminence questions? Just online submission to some general inbox?
Regarding the baskets; I have a hobbyist's interest in metal working. I could be wrong, but stamping dies are pretty expensive to make (and calibrate so you know you get what you want). Probably uneconomical for a hobbyist. I'd be willing to bet that almost all manufacturers use either stamping or casting. In general casting lets you have more complex shapes; however modern CNC multi-step stamping + finishing machining can probably do just as much if not more. I'd guess most manufacturers do it with some combination of cut + pressure die + finishing machining.
If you're good, you could free-hand bend/stretch/hammer+wheel a few samples with jigs to guide you. Guys who are good at sheet metal manipulation can do some absolutely amazing stuff.
If the part is small, you could consider getting a company like i.materialize to sinter one for you, costs are highly volume dependent. Start with test samples made out of plastic and then make them in stainless steel or ($$$) titanium. I would guess this route isn't an option for any speakers bigger than 4", unless you can use a plastic substitute.
Another option is to find a cheap part which has something close to what you need and cannibalize it.
If you're good, you could free-hand bend/stretch/hammer+wheel a few samples with jigs to guide you. Guys who are good at sheet metal manipulation can do some absolutely amazing stuff.
If the part is small, you could consider getting a company like i.materialize to sinter one for you, costs are highly volume dependent. Start with test samples made out of plastic and then make them in stainless steel or ($$$) titanium. I would guess this route isn't an option for any speakers bigger than 4", unless you can use a plastic substitute.
Another option is to find a cheap part which has something close to what you need and cannibalize it.
I make my own speakers from scratch, but still buy some parts.
For the frames you need a very expensive (think what a house will cost) set of pressing and punching dies, plus mechanical presses and sometimes a hydraulic one.
Think 200 Ton presses for the largest dies.
Speaker Frame Punch Press Windows - YouTube
When I started I couldn´t afford them so Plan B was to make the speaker frame models in wood , have them sandcast in aluminum and then lathe turn them to have flat precision surfaces where needed.
Then I started making very ugly ones by sheet metal turning (in Spanish: "tornería de repusaje") , what´s used to make kitchen pans, aluminum light reflectors, etc.
No need for very heavy machinery, just the frame shape turned in some suitable hardwood and then you go to some sheet stamping shop and give them a few bucks to use some round hole punching die they have rusting on some shelf, to punch round frame holes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dlAnmEpRIw8
As of spiders, you must have some lathe guy turn matching male and female dies in iron or aluminum, you mount them in a press with resistive elements to heat them, and press phenolic rosin impregnated cloth between them.
After a minute or 2 cooking, they separate and you have the now rigid and shaped spider.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryOQimoTAZc
In a nutshell, *everything* can be made, the problem is whether you can afford the tooling and have future sales to recover investment.
As of
For the frames you need a very expensive (think what a house will cost) set of pressing and punching dies, plus mechanical presses and sometimes a hydraulic one.
Think 200 Ton presses for the largest dies.
Speaker Frame Punch Press Windows - YouTube
When I started I couldn´t afford them so Plan B was to make the speaker frame models in wood , have them sandcast in aluminum and then lathe turn them to have flat precision surfaces where needed.
Then I started making very ugly ones by sheet metal turning (in Spanish: "tornería de repusaje") , what´s used to make kitchen pans, aluminum light reflectors, etc.
No need for very heavy machinery, just the frame shape turned in some suitable hardwood and then you go to some sheet stamping shop and give them a few bucks to use some round hole punching die they have rusting on some shelf, to punch round frame holes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dlAnmEpRIw8
As of spiders, you must have some lathe guy turn matching male and female dies in iron or aluminum, you mount them in a press with resistive elements to heat them, and press phenolic rosin impregnated cloth between them.
After a minute or 2 cooking, they separate and you have the now rigid and shaped spider.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryOQimoTAZc
In a nutshell, *everything* can be made, the problem is whether you can afford the tooling and have future sales to recover investment.
As of
Hah. that second video was very illuminating. Thanks! Here's a CNC version of the same lathe spinning operation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28vTKdSHMk8
One major loudspeaker manufacturer some years back bought the then worlds largest press. It was used and so large it wasn't moved. So they also had to buy the entire plant. It enabled them to stamp some very large baskets. Don't know if it is still in use. For an idea of scale I have a small press used for bending sheet metal. It is only rated at 50 tons and could probably be used with special tooling to do a 4" frame certainly not an 8".
If you make a wood version of a basket you can used that as a master for sand casting. There is stuff on the web for diy casting.
If you make a wood version of a basket you can used that as a master for sand casting. There is stuff on the web for diy casting.
ALL parts are available from suppliers who will even supply wound voice coils. So what is the point in making it and investing dead funds. If it's to make something specialised and different from the norm then it becomes a full fledged business venture. But I think you don't want to go there.
To gift speakers you can buy drivers from say, Parts Express, when they have a tent sale or a sale on the Web. Prices are ridiculously low. Much lower than the cost of the parts !
There is much more to doing things like say making spiders. It's NOT as simple as doping fabric and heating it in a press. There are many parameters you need to control. If you just throw parts together , you will not be able to say what the performance of the end result will be. MUCH better to buy finished drivers. Unless you are doing this just to spend excess money and have some fun.
Have a look at Voice Coil magazine !
To gift speakers you can buy drivers from say, Parts Express, when they have a tent sale or a sale on the Web. Prices are ridiculously low. Much lower than the cost of the parts !
There is much more to doing things like say making spiders. It's NOT as simple as doping fabric and heating it in a press. There are many parameters you need to control. If you just throw parts together , you will not be able to say what the performance of the end result will be. MUCH better to buy finished drivers. Unless you are doing this just to spend excess money and have some fun.
Have a look at Voice Coil magazine !
The spider is that flexible thing down by the voice coil.
here is a drawing that shows a spider:
Facts about Blown Speakers - Knowledge Base
here is a drawing that shows a spider:
Facts about Blown Speakers - Knowledge Base
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
that could work for a sealed & highly damped midrange unit, but for anything lower in frequency, open backed basket should probably be considered essential
theoretically, with precise enough jigs, you could weld or glue a skeletal framework together that would rigidly affix the drive train in alignment with the cone and peripheral surround
theoretically, with precise enough jigs, you could weld or glue a skeletal framework together that would rigidly affix the drive train in alignment with the cone and peripheral surround
FWIW I´m a *tiny* guitar speaker maker, and after beginning with sandcast cast baskets (also cloned Altec sectoral horns) and then spun ones, I wanted to go the stamped route.
I make most of what I use: transformers, PCB, chassis, front panels, even corner protectors, rubber legs, strip handles, etc. ... and speakers.
But while as I said before , most anything can be made, big problem is initial inversion, both in machinery and dies, so my "Plan B" was always to find Industries who make, for their own use, products or parts similar to what I need .
Otherwise it would be economically impossible.
BIG saviours were *Car* Industry suppliers.
The guy who stamps my frames starts with blanks (think a 16" square sheet of 16ga cold rolled steel with a 12" blind cone stamped in the center) which *he* uses (in a much thicker gauge) to make part of a car wheel cap.
I rambled through his rusty dusty die shelves until I assembled a set which would punch necessary holes to turn that raw cone into a usable speaker frame ... BINGO !!!!
Instead of the horrible round holes I had been punching into my ugly spun frames, I found a quite usable trapezoidal one (think holes in Celestion frames) which "he" used to punch glass window raising mechanism holes in car doors.
As of spiders, never had to make my own, but if needed, a friend´s uncle makes bras and he has a machine to press semirigid bra cups and told me if I bring my own dies he can press anything I want in any hardness, from fluffy soft to phenolic horn diaphragm hard.
I´m tempted to custom make some vintage style brown phenolic cloth dustcaps, go figure.
So in a nutshell, if you live in or near an Industrial city, you can find help in many places.
Here in Buenos Aires within a 20 mile radius I can find *anything* and, more important, people who will talk to me.
On the left my frame ... I guess you´ll recognize the one on the right 😉
My Sectoral horn mold for sandcasting:
Try that with Chinese suppliers, unless you order thousands of parts 😉
I make most of what I use: transformers, PCB, chassis, front panels, even corner protectors, rubber legs, strip handles, etc. ... and speakers.
But while as I said before , most anything can be made, big problem is initial inversion, both in machinery and dies, so my "Plan B" was always to find Industries who make, for their own use, products or parts similar to what I need .
Otherwise it would be economically impossible.
BIG saviours were *Car* Industry suppliers.
The guy who stamps my frames starts with blanks (think a 16" square sheet of 16ga cold rolled steel with a 12" blind cone stamped in the center) which *he* uses (in a much thicker gauge) to make part of a car wheel cap.
I rambled through his rusty dusty die shelves until I assembled a set which would punch necessary holes to turn that raw cone into a usable speaker frame ... BINGO !!!!
Instead of the horrible round holes I had been punching into my ugly spun frames, I found a quite usable trapezoidal one (think holes in Celestion frames) which "he" used to punch glass window raising mechanism holes in car doors.
As of spiders, never had to make my own, but if needed, a friend´s uncle makes bras and he has a machine to press semirigid bra cups and told me if I bring my own dies he can press anything I want in any hardness, from fluffy soft to phenolic horn diaphragm hard.
I´m tempted to custom make some vintage style brown phenolic cloth dustcaps, go figure.
So in a nutshell, if you live in or near an Industrial city, you can find help in many places.
Here in Buenos Aires within a 20 mile radius I can find *anything* and, more important, people who will talk to me.
On the left my frame ... I guess you´ll recognize the one on the right 😉
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
My Sectoral horn mold for sandcasting:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Try that with Chinese suppliers, unless you order thousands of parts 😉
One option is to get a 3D printer and print the frame in wax. Then use the wax model to make a mold in plaster and burn the wax out. The same idea can be used to make a die set for spiders.
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