I am considering building an open baffle system. I have a few questions;
First and foremost is my room and speaker position suitable?
I am limited in where I can place these speakers due to room size & aesthetics. The room is ~15'x25'x8.5' ~3,200 cu. ft. The front wall is 15' wide. The front baffle of the speakers are about 27" off the front wall, the inside edge of the cabinets are about 40" off the side walls. There may be a few inches of play but not much. The main listening position is in about the middle of the room say 12' off the front wall.
Second, I am looking at using GR-Research open baffle subs for the "woofer" section. Specifically each speaker would have a dual 12" "H" or "W" woofer section. What are the thoughts on this configuration? The components minus cabinet are about $1,500. Are there other options that will yield similar results for less?
Finally, The squawker & tweeter section that Danny of GR-Research recommends is the NX-Otica MTM which with the flat pack, and xover runs about $1,000. I was thinking about an Eminence 8" pro driver and an AudioPur PLA114-6. What options should I consider if I'm on a budget?
BTW, I am leaning towards the GR-Research woofer assembly due to my happiness with a Rythmik Audio DS1500 I have used for at least 5 years.
First and foremost is my room and speaker position suitable?
I am limited in where I can place these speakers due to room size & aesthetics. The room is ~15'x25'x8.5' ~3,200 cu. ft. The front wall is 15' wide. The front baffle of the speakers are about 27" off the front wall, the inside edge of the cabinets are about 40" off the side walls. There may be a few inches of play but not much. The main listening position is in about the middle of the room say 12' off the front wall.
Second, I am looking at using GR-Research open baffle subs for the "woofer" section. Specifically each speaker would have a dual 12" "H" or "W" woofer section. What are the thoughts on this configuration? The components minus cabinet are about $1,500. Are there other options that will yield similar results for less?
Finally, The squawker & tweeter section that Danny of GR-Research recommends is the NX-Otica MTM which with the flat pack, and xover runs about $1,000. I was thinking about an Eminence 8" pro driver and an AudioPur PLA114-6. What options should I consider if I'm on a budget?
BTW, I am leaning towards the GR-Research woofer assembly due to my happiness with a Rythmik Audio DS1500 I have used for at least 5 years.
It seems like you've set off with this backwards. Bolting a load of drivers to a baffle will make sound, but might not make music.
Set off with design criteria, and work through to design a system that will meet the criteria.
Some things to think about:
- What size are you looking at?
- How low do you want to go?
- How loud do you want to go?
- What's the budget?
- What's your amplification?
- Do you have/want active crossovers?
You might find you're gonna need 2x18" a side to achieve your low-frequency SPL goals. That's okay, but its better to find out now than drop a lot of money on some expensive 12"s that sound great at low levels, but bottom out when you want to party. That's no fun at all.
OB bass is non-trivial - most would consider a 15" a side to be the minimum requirement.
Chris
Set off with design criteria, and work through to design a system that will meet the criteria.
Some things to think about:
- What size are you looking at?
- How low do you want to go?
- How loud do you want to go?
- What's the budget?
- What's your amplification?
- Do you have/want active crossovers?
You might find you're gonna need 2x18" a side to achieve your low-frequency SPL goals. That's okay, but its better to find out now than drop a lot of money on some expensive 12"s that sound great at low levels, but bottom out when you want to party. That's no fun at all.
OB bass is non-trivial - most would consider a 15" a side to be the minimum requirement.
Chris
Hmmmm ( Hi ! ) going with bigger and bigger drivers brings troubles!
And that happens with conventional speakers-in-boxes where the rear wave is partially absorbed, go figure when you allow the rear wave of a speaker to enter the same space....as the rear wave represents 100% error signal.
Can you recognize what comes from the frontal emission of a speaker and the same emission mixed with the same but in antiphase ?! If you do not allow the back wave to extinguish ( naturally or by the means of some acoustic absorber material ) away from you -that means >in another room or outside - you're not going to hear the single signal but some nasty interactions.
😱
And that happens with conventional speakers-in-boxes where the rear wave is partially absorbed, go figure when you allow the rear wave of a speaker to enter the same space....as the rear wave represents 100% error signal.
Can you recognize what comes from the frontal emission of a speaker and the same emission mixed with the same but in antiphase ?! If you do not allow the back wave to extinguish ( naturally or by the means of some acoustic absorber material ) away from you -that means >in another room or outside - you're not going to hear the single signal but some nasty interactions.
😱
Chris, thanks for the reply. I didn't think I was going about it totally bass-ackwards. My assumptions include;
GR-Research's OB woofer system seems to be a somewhat known quantity, and since the most challenging piece of the OB puzzle seems to be the lower frequencies, I thought I would start wit something that has been proven.
I grant you that my suggestion for the other components are based on throwing drivers at a board, but that's why I'm here😀.
So my first question still remains, would an OB system be optimal in the environment I stated. If not the rest is moot.
In answer to how low do I want go, how loud, amplification, etc.
The goal of these speakers is to replace a pair of B&W 802 Matrix S3. The amplification is currently 600 @ 8 ohms 1,000 @ 4 ohms per channel.
I would like to avoid active crossovers.
My budget is flexible, but since it is a hobby, I tend to keep my costs down.
GR-Research's OB woofer system seems to be a somewhat known quantity, and since the most challenging piece of the OB puzzle seems to be the lower frequencies, I thought I would start wit something that has been proven.
I grant you that my suggestion for the other components are based on throwing drivers at a board, but that's why I'm here😀.
So my first question still remains, would an OB system be optimal in the environment I stated. If not the rest is moot.
In answer to how low do I want go, how loud, amplification, etc.
The goal of these speakers is to replace a pair of B&W 802 Matrix S3. The amplification is currently 600 @ 8 ohms 1,000 @ 4 ohms per channel.
I would like to avoid active crossovers.
My budget is flexible, but since it is a hobby, I tend to keep my costs down.
Hi, figured I'd jump in and mention a couple of things...
First off, you'll have no issue with the size of your room with either the OB H/W frames nor the NX-Ottica MTM's. Youi'll want them off the front wall a bit further , usally 36" is considered minimum.
The combo of Danny's new NQ midrange driver and the open Neo 3 PDR or Danny's upcoming tweeter is amazing Not a lot of the NX Ottica MTM's out there yet but the guys that do have them are very impressed. For guys in the DFW area, AFAIK there will be a pair of the NX Ottica MTM's / dual 12" OB servo contolled H-frames displayed at the 2017 LSAF by M Lunddy.
The OB servo controlled bass is extremely accurate and fast, you won't find cleaner bass. I'd suggest you spend the extra $ and use the no rez in the cabinets... These subs will play flat to 20Hz so no issue with bass extension
jay
First off, you'll have no issue with the size of your room with either the OB H/W frames nor the NX-Ottica MTM's. Youi'll want them off the front wall a bit further , usally 36" is considered minimum.
The combo of Danny's new NQ midrange driver and the open Neo 3 PDR or Danny's upcoming tweeter is amazing Not a lot of the NX Ottica MTM's out there yet but the guys that do have them are very impressed. For guys in the DFW area, AFAIK there will be a pair of the NX Ottica MTM's / dual 12" OB servo contolled H-frames displayed at the 2017 LSAF by M Lunddy.
The OB servo controlled bass is extremely accurate and fast, you won't find cleaner bass. I'd suggest you spend the extra $ and use the no rez in the cabinets... These subs will play flat to 20Hz so no issue with bass extension
jay
CaptainHemo, is 36" from the front baffle to the boundary wall, or the rear of the cabinet?
I currently have a Rythmik Audio DS1500, and am pleased with the bass. The purpose of these speakers is not to replace the subs I have, but to provide something better than my B&W 802 Matrix speakers. Also an excuse to make some sawdust.
I currently have a Rythmik Audio DS1500, and am pleased with the bass. The purpose of these speakers is not to replace the subs I have, but to provide something better than my B&W 802 Matrix speakers. Also an excuse to make some sawdust.
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If you go 36" off teh rear side of the bafle you should be good but as mentioned, if you can get them a bit further out into the room so much the btter.
You'll find the OB subs load the room much more evenly than the sealed DS1500's., you get very even distribution and no boom
If the subs will all be in the same room, run the DS1500's in the rear corners at a low volume and 180 out of phase from the h-frames up front
jay
You'll find the OB subs load the room much more evenly than the sealed DS1500's., you get very even distribution and no boom
If the subs will all be in the same room, run the DS1500's in the rear corners at a low volume and 180 out of phase from the h-frames up front
jay
Of course "600 @ 8 ohms 1,000 @ 4 ohms per channel" Should be 600 watts @ 8 ohms 1,000 watts @ 4 ohms per channel.
Power is care of Emotiva XPA-1 Gen 1s.
Power is care of Emotiva XPA-1 Gen 1s.
Jay, the DS1500, and franken sub (I do not have two DS1500s) would be used mainly for HT. During HT use I would be running the new speakers full range from my sound processor, the subs would be run as sub 1 & 2 as they are now all controlled by Dirac.
During two channel music I would be running the new speakers in direct mode with no processing from the sound processor.
During two channel music I would be running the new speakers in direct mode with no processing from the sound processor.
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