I want to try these 100Hz high pass filters with my full range speakers (TABAQ with 4FE32) in a 2.1 bi-amped setup with a sub. For the sub-woofer I am using a cheap Ali active low pass filter specifically for subs, but no high pass for the full rangers yet. For the full range speakers I also use a BSC (1mH + 8ohm). Some questions:
Does anyone have experience with these filters and do they improve full range driver performance in practice? Any negative effects?
Where do I put them? Between amp and speakers, but before or after the BSC? Does it matter?
Does anyone have experience with these filters and do they improve full range driver performance in practice? Any negative effects?
Where do I put them? Between amp and speakers, but before or after the BSC? Does it matter?
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These are speaker level crossovers. There are three things to consider...
1. Sometimes bass is better when you don't cross the mains. Ok maybe these will ease the burden on your fullrange drivers and there are other ways to manage your bass, so something to consider.
2. How will these interact with your driver's impedance at it's resonance..
3. How will it interact with the BSC circuit..
Would you consider simulating this to make the comparison? You'll at least need the impedance plot for your fullrange.
1. Sometimes bass is better when you don't cross the mains. Ok maybe these will ease the burden on your fullrange drivers and there are other ways to manage your bass, so something to consider.
2. How will these interact with your driver's impedance at it's resonance..
3. How will it interact with the BSC circuit..
Would you consider simulating this to make the comparison? You'll at least need the impedance plot for your fullrange.
You should measure the driver and build a filter for that on the measurements. If the driver does less bass it's less stressed so it willsound better.
Typical bsc is before the high/low pass filters of a crossover. But i don't thin you will need BSC on this as if you filter there is no bass to boost from that cabinet.
Typical bsc is before the high/low pass filters of a crossover. But i don't thin you will need BSC on this as if you filter there is no bass to boost from that cabinet.
@AllenB – Thank you for the response. At this point – no, I won’t consider simulating this. Wouldn’t even know where to begin.
I am actually very happy with the bass as it is currently. I think the sub integrates very well with the full rangers. These TABAQ speakers have very good and low bass for their size. Just thought I could get marginal improvement by easing the burden on the 4” drivers.
I am planning on measuring (got the Dayton microphone and REW downloaded), but with the idea to apply EQ. Not to design filters. This is all new to me and a challenging learning curve.
But thanks, I might just try the filters as you suggested – with and without the BSC, just to hear what it sounds like. Maybe I can improve on their already excellent performance.
Why use a speaker level HPF? It seems inelegant to ask your amp to do all that work <100Hz, where often a significant percentage of music energy is contained and then not use it. If its a low power tube amp its almost insulting to it.
What about doing an active line level crossover?
https://www.parts-express.com/Rolls-SX45-Stereo-Two-Way-Mini-Crossover-w-Sub-Output-245-1184
Or Passive line level
https://www.parts-express.com/FMOD-Crossover-Pair-100-Hz-High-Pass-266-274
https://www.parts-express.com/FMOD-Crossover-Pair-100-Hz-Low-Pass-266-254
Or a full digital system with XO and equalisers via a multichannel DAC?
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I'm using moOde on a RPi connected to an i2s DAC. Using EQ to high pass will unfortunately not work in this case - the line level out must also go to the sub-woofer amp.
Thanks for the links. The speaker level HPF seemed a simple solution for my setup. But those Harrison Labs inline crossovers look even better or easier.
Maybe I should just do an active line level crossover and be done with it. I have been looking at Nelson's diy biamp 6-24 crossover, but I am not sure if one can easily swap out amps when using such a crossover in your system.
Your TABAQ reaches 55Hz on its own. Do you have the feeling that the drivers struggle? Is that why you want to get rid from 100Hz and below?
If not, I would just set the sub to play up to 50Hz, and be done. Or try them up to 100Hzand hear if the bass meshes well or interferes with each other, the TABAQs and the sub.
I wouldn’t use those from Parts Express. They are generic, made with just the math calculation, using very cheap cap and inductor. They will not follow your system impedance.
If you have REW, there‘s a little hack to get the system impedance.
Or just use the sim that Bjorn did for the Faital, the impedance usually follow quite well real life data.
From there, you can choose which cap and inductor you want.
If not, I would just set the sub to play up to 50Hz, and be done. Or try them up to 100Hzand hear if the bass meshes well or interferes with each other, the TABAQs and the sub.
I wouldn’t use those from Parts Express. They are generic, made with just the math calculation, using very cheap cap and inductor. They will not follow your system impedance.
If you have REW, there‘s a little hack to get the system impedance.
Or just use the sim that Bjorn did for the Faital, the impedance usually follow quite well real life data.
From there, you can choose which cap and inductor you want.
@perceval, the TABAQ guru. Thank you for chiming in. No, I never got the feeling that these drivers struggle. In fact, I get the feeling these 4FE32 drivers can take some beating before they lose control. I only play them load when demonstrating and trying to impress others. So stupid. Normal listening levels are pretty low.
For the sub-woofer I can play around with the LP filter – anything between 50Hz and 150Hz to mesh them with the TABAQs. And the filter is currently set according to my ears. Once I have the mic and REW setup it could help me measure the TABAQ roll off and set the sub-woofer LP accordingly.
For the sub-woofer I can play around with the LP filter – anything between 50Hz and 150Hz to mesh them with the TABAQs. And the filter is currently set according to my ears. Once I have the mic and REW setup it could help me measure the TABAQ roll off and set the sub-woofer LP accordingly.
Noted, thanks. I have also considered Dave’s PLLXO filters and might look at that again in future, but then you need to know the amp impedance and build the filter around that. I knew the impedance when the ACA was in my system, but that was 3 amps ago.
A hard thing to do. This is diy and I am always tinkering and trying to improve things. Does this urge ever go away?
I completely understand.
Then, when you get your mic and REW, just play around with the LP setting until it is just right. Then enjoy good sound and extended low end! 🙂
What is the sub anyway? You mentioned it but you didn't say what it is.
Never!
10” Rockford Fosgate P1 Punch in a 25 liter sealed box, driven by a TPA3116 100W mono amp currently. I love the tight punchy bass. Used mainly for music, not HT.
What is your experience - what subs integrate well with MLTL speakers? Maybe a good question to ask on the TABAQ thread rather.