Hi! I'm planning to upgrade the sound system in my car. Since my car is a Mini, I already have very limited space. I'm leaning towards getting rid of the rear 6.5 speakers and putting in a pair of these: Tang Band W6-2253S 6-1/2" Low Profile Subwoofer
Plus, to me having rear speakers makes it sound muddy, I like my fader set to the fronts only. How bad of an idea is putting those subwoofers in that location? I know there's not much airspace, so I'm wondering if they'll actually hit lower frequencies at all. I don't want "thumping" bass. I just want it to sound "full" and I want to be able to crank it up to a reasonably loud level every so often.
That's my other concern, the sensitivity of these subs seems pretty low at 80 db/ watt. I will of course be powering these with an amplifier, and will make sure they get atleast 100w per sub. Will these still be too weak for a car environment? Should I look for something more efficient or a higher power rating? Like I said, I usually listen at moderate levels but like cranking it up occasionally. The stock h/k speakers in this car were "crankable" enough for me but sounded awful.
Plus, to me having rear speakers makes it sound muddy, I like my fader set to the fronts only. How bad of an idea is putting those subwoofers in that location? I know there's not much airspace, so I'm wondering if they'll actually hit lower frequencies at all. I don't want "thumping" bass. I just want it to sound "full" and I want to be able to crank it up to a reasonably loud level every so often.
That's my other concern, the sensitivity of these subs seems pretty low at 80 db/ watt. I will of course be powering these with an amplifier, and will make sure they get atleast 100w per sub. Will these still be too weak for a car environment? Should I look for something more efficient or a higher power rating? Like I said, I usually listen at moderate levels but like cranking it up occasionally. The stock h/k speakers in this car were "crankable" enough for me but sounded awful.
From the description of the driver, it sounds as if this was specifically designed for this application...as such, it probably is designed for an aperiodic (Leaky sealed) enclosure..as one would find in a door cavity.
Yes, that is the lowest of sensitivities I've seen, and a really big amp is seriously required.
Without crafting a custom enclosure, either sealed or ported...it's sounding as if this is the best they can come up with on a drop-in design.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------Rick......
Yes, that is the lowest of sensitivities I've seen, and a really big amp is seriously required.
Without crafting a custom enclosure, either sealed or ported...it's sounding as if this is the best they can come up with on a drop-in design.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------Rick......
How big of an amp would be advisable? I know in general it's better to overpower subs a bit, but the rms rating on these is only 100w, should I really go much above that?
Plus how loud does a subwoofer really need to be for car audio? In a small closed environment I'd imagine there's something similar to room gain? So if I had two of those subs and gave them 100w each, that would be something like 105 decibels max right? But because it's in a car, would that be enough? I can't imagine the stock rear midbass drivers in my car being that efficient either, and I'm fine with how loud they get, just not how they sound.
It’s more of a midbass than a subwoofer in my opinion. The whole idea of a subwoofer is that it is crossed over low enough and phased/time aligned so that it doesn’t sound like it’s coming from behind you.
I would have them, as midbasses, bandpassed at 63hz and 250Hz and integrate them with my front stage midrange and tweeters but would probably find them lacking in “sub” bass.
I would have them, as midbasses, bandpassed at 63hz and 250Hz and integrate them with my front stage midrange and tweeters but would probably find them lacking in “sub” bass.
I think that's good enough for me as long as I can push it to maybe 45-50 hz? I don't listen to anything that requires lower than that really, I would prefer a full size subwoofer, but my space is really really limited.
Yes, so like room modes. I'm not sure how much I should count on this though, I just don't want to strain these subs that hard at slightly higher listening volumes. I do want to use eq with this, so hopefully I can use the headroom I get from cabin gain to make them go a bit deeper.
I’m sure you can run them that low, at the expense of slightly less overall power handling.
I would think it would have no problems considering the fs is 40 hertz? I'm just worried they won't be loud enough for the interior of the car. They look designed to go low but not have much volume... I'm hoping a 2 channel amp running 150 watts to each would be enough power.
It’s not so much about having enough power, rather that the lower the speaker is required to play the less volume ( or input power if you like) you can put in to it before reaching it’s mechanical or distortion acceptability.
In this case, given that it’s in a car and a bunch of compromises have to be made, I would not worry too much about playing low and aim for a satisfying sound that goes loud enough for you. Getting any real bass between 80-40hz will need a subwoofer.
Start with the high pass filter at around 50hz and try higher and lower with different kinds of music to see what you prefer
I think we sometimes get a little caught up in precise numerical goals and forget that getting the thing sounding good is thing in the first place.
6.5” drivers output will likely be centered around 80hz in a decently prepared door, and sound fine. You will find that most modern cars doors sound awful with any amount of power as provided originally and that the rewards will come from how effectively you can get them to function, aside from the actual drivers.
Got it, that makes sense. The original 6.5"s that came with the car look designed for bass, although they run fullrange, they could hit down to 45 hertz or so pretty cleanly. Honestly, I find the design strange compared to other cars I've been, it's like the rear enclosures were designed to be used for subs. I was always impressed with the amount of bass they could put out but they never sounded very clean. I considered keeping them but I don't think they can handle much power either, so hopefully these advertised "subwoofers" can put out cleaner bass than the stock 6.5s.
The stock 6.5s in the rear of the car actually went down to 40-45 hertz, they were more designed for bass I think than anything else. I'm hoping when I replace these in a few days the new drivers can go as deep but atleast play cleaner than the original 6.5s.
They will probably go down to 30hz or so, but the peak will be higher unless you limit the output by way of filtering the signal and reducing the output.
And stock doors are pretty flimsy these days, so along with the lower notes, you’ll get some extra resonances that aren’t part of the recordings, your doors, and everything attached to them will be singing their own tune.
And stock doors are pretty flimsy these days, so along with the lower notes, you’ll get some extra resonances that aren’t part of the recordings, your doors, and everything attached to them will be singing their own tune.
Edit: Sorry, but NOT pretty cleanly, realized I was tired and contradicted myself. 😀
That was my main gripe with the stock bass drivers, they did go deep, but everything rattled back there when it was cranked up. I'm hoping to fix some of this by adding a bunch of sound dampening on the panels.
So the oem speakers had a lot less power put to them and rattled everything, just wondering if you’re prepared to deal with two to three times that much power?
I only have (maybe) 70 watts to the doors in a similar sized car and it’s been an effort to keep everything from buzzing, wouldn’t want to know what three times that much power would do.
People do it all the time, but it can be pretty consuming, with having to constantly take the interior in and out to perform the ongoing fabrication work to achieve performance at those levels. Keep in mind that the doors can get wet too, so anything you do inside needs to be made accordingly so as to not turn into a mushroom farm.
I’m sure it would be very rewarding once it was done, however. Have you searched around on the dedicated car audio forums? They can be pretty rough as far as personalities go, but lots of great information, if you’re willing to dig.
I only have (maybe) 70 watts to the doors in a similar sized car and it’s been an effort to keep everything from buzzing, wouldn’t want to know what three times that much power would do.
People do it all the time, but it can be pretty consuming, with having to constantly take the interior in and out to perform the ongoing fabrication work to achieve performance at those levels. Keep in mind that the doors can get wet too, so anything you do inside needs to be made accordingly so as to not turn into a mushroom farm.
I’m sure it would be very rewarding once it was done, however. Have you searched around on the dedicated car audio forums? They can be pretty rough as far as personalities go, but lots of great information, if you’re willing to dig.
Maybe I'm dissing it too much, 😀 It's not bad for what it is. The stereos in a lot of my friends' cars seem to produce crappier bass that rattle panels more than the stock one in mine. You wouldn't really notice the rattling with bass in my car unless you cranked it up close to max. While normally listening to music I didn't notice unless I really listened for it. It looks well insulated to me from the elements, and the enclosure does look like it's designed primarily for bass. It's definitely a large cavity for a 6.5 inch woofer. Have you been running sound dampening in your car? I don't know how much power the original woofers were running, but if I had to guess maybe 40-50 watts per channel in the rear because they are dvc. I'm just really counting on sound dampening to minimize vibrations. I'll admit I'm ignorant when it comes to car audio, do you have any forms you would suggest? I'm unaware of them. 🙂