Hey guys I know this may be a little of topic in repairs. But I'm planning on building my own box instead of just going to the local stereo shop to buy one already made. I recently got these two kicker comp vr 15's off Craigslist for $90 and the box they came in is absolute crap it's to small for them. I did some thinking and buying a prefab box will cost me approx 60 - $80 which I could use that $ to build a way better box for these subs. I was either thinking a ported or large sealed box. Note that I have zero wood working skills! I'd like to go with the easiest to build. So what would you guys recommend for these old school cvrs? Amp I will be using? Varies I have so many I like to switch. Mostly Rockford. I will also be using and epicenter for those old school jams. I want that low, loud smooth bass. Can anyone give me any pointers? Also does home depot cut the wood for you? I don't have a jig saw or skill saw that's why.
15s ported will be a big *** box,
you want low tuning for the box if you are using an epicenter.
i would push them with a 1000RMS amplifier, but you need to know what impedance are the coils, they are dual 4 ohm, you will need a 1 ohm stable amplifier.
if they are dual 2 ohm, you will need a 2ohm or .5ohm stable amplifier.
Also for the box you need 3/4MDF or 1" MDF if possible.
you want low tuning for the box if you are using an epicenter.
i would push them with a 1000RMS amplifier, but you need to know what impedance are the coils, they are dual 4 ohm, you will need a 1 ohm stable amplifier.
if they are dual 2 ohm, you will need a 2ohm or .5ohm stable amplifier.
Also for the box you need 3/4MDF or 1" MDF if possible.
Look up the owner's manual to see what enclosures they recommend.
Sealed will be the easiest. Ported will be larger. Not much more difficult if you use a round port.
There are suggestions for enclosure building on the enclosure page of my car audio site (page 110).
Big-box stores will cut large sheets down to size but they won't guarantee tolerances. The first 2 cuts are generally free then about $0.50 each after that. The cuts will be better than a jig saw and the enclosure size isn't so critical that a small error in size will make any audible difference.
Sealed will be the easiest. Ported will be larger. Not much more difficult if you use a round port.
There are suggestions for enclosure building on the enclosure page of my car audio site (page 110).
Big-box stores will cut large sheets down to size but they won't guarantee tolerances. The first 2 cuts are generally free then about $0.50 each after that. The cuts will be better than a jig saw and the enclosure size isn't so critical that a small error in size will make any audible difference.
These are dual 4 ohm. I will be powering them with a Rockford Fosgate punch 800a2 at 2 ohm each channel.
These are dual 4 ohm. I will be powering them with a Rockford Fosgate punch 800a2 at 2 ohm each channel.
You could also run series parallel and have a 4 ohm load to bridge to the 800a2 instead of 2 ohm stereo each channel. The amp will be ran hard so its gonna get HOT!!! 2 ohm stereo each channel or 4 ohm bridged either way your going to be pushing it hard to get a 1000 watts to those subs.
You could run 1 ohm and pick up a 1 ohm stable mono amp for fairly cheap. The mono amp depending on size will draw less and run way cooler, it will be more efficient, and more reliable.
You could also run series parallel and have a 4 ohm load to bridge to the 800a2 instead of 2 ohm stereo each channel. The amp will be ran hard so its gonna get HOT!!! 2 ohm stereo each channel or 4 ohm bridged either way your going to be pushing it hard to get a 1000 watts to those subs.
You could run 1 ohm and pick up a 1 ohm stable mono amp for fairly cheap. The mono amp depending on size will draw less and run way cooler, it will be more efficient, and more reliable.
My experience sealed enclosures usually have tighter more controlled bass, better sound quality. On the down side sealed enclosures generally require a much higher power amp to get the sound your looking for.
If you like big, boomy, fierce, bass and don't have a huge amp go ported. You have more tuning options with ported.
In an earlier post I read these speakers were meant for sealed only, guess you need to read the manual.
If you like big, boomy, fierce, bass and don't have a huge amp go ported. You have more tuning options with ported.
In an earlier post I read these speakers were meant for sealed only, guess you need to read the manual.
that rockford amp will do great.
If you are using an epicenter you would prefer ported box, tuned around 35hz - 40hz
You need the subwoofer specs to know what size of box you need.
If you are using an epicenter you would prefer ported box, tuned around 35hz - 40hz
You need the subwoofer specs to know what size of box you need.
The Xmax in mm is .492 which is really low. It's the subs ability to move in both directions when powered. If you look at this subs xmax HDC its 40mm total which is a lot of movement ability which would tell you its a good sub to port.
In other words if you port this box you'll run the risk of burning up the voicecoil faster then in a sealed box which gives the sub much more controlled movement.
In other words if you port this box you'll run the risk of burning up the voicecoil faster then in a sealed box which gives the sub much more controlled movement.
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Hi chipper.
What vehicle will you be putting them in? How much space do you have to work with? The space that you are willing to give up or have available will help determine which enclosure you end up with.
Regards
Matt
What vehicle will you be putting them in? How much space do you have to work with? The space that you are willing to give up or have available will help determine which enclosure you end up with.
Regards
Matt
I'd start by downloading a free copy of WinISD Pro, find the thielle/small parameters of your subwoofers, input them into the programs database and have some fun playing with the box designs. You can measure your current enlcosure, model it in the program, then compare it to your new design to see how the output will change.
You might try what I did. Put the woofs front and rear. Bipolar. Add bottom firing passive, or UNDRIVEN speaker. Ignore the advice that passive should be larger. It will require less power, go lower, Stay tight. Not excite walls or step on other HZ.
And if it doesn't work to your liking, burn the box. No weight on passive.
And if it doesn't work to your liking, burn the box. No weight on passive.
I would run those sealed, with the largest recommended space per woofer that kicker recommends. Also, separate them into two chambers. Run them series each woofer to 8 ohm then parallel them at the amp bridged to get 4 ohm at the amp...like you mentioned. Be sure to use separate speaker wire all the way to the amp, at least 14 gauge thick, so they get as much current as possible. That amp will beat the crap out of those subs, 4 ohm mono will heat it up but not any more than 2 ohm stereo and the woofer control will also be better.
If you are using an epicenter, and are not super experienced with box and system design and tuning, that is another good reason to run a sealed box. That will take a few factors out of the picture for simplicity's sake and add a little more safety for the speakers. Keep in mind that making the box as large as recommended will add a little more low end spl, but will also lower power handling of the subs. Try and find out what they will handle at their maximum box size before deciding how large to go. I would run the largest size recommended personally, if there was room, it would be more risky but the response of the woofers would be worth it in my opinion.
If you are using an epicenter, and are not super experienced with box and system design and tuning, that is another good reason to run a sealed box. That will take a few factors out of the picture for simplicity's sake and add a little more safety for the speakers. Keep in mind that making the box as large as recommended will add a little more low end spl, but will also lower power handling of the subs. Try and find out what they will handle at their maximum box size before deciding how large to go. I would run the largest size recommended personally, if there was room, it would be more risky but the response of the woofers would be worth it in my opinion.
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This post might be a little old, but figured I'd throw 2 bits at it anyways.
Sealed boxes can be smaller, oddly shaped, etc. and provide excellent bass assuming you position your subs to face the rear of the car, so the sound waves reflect back at you. This is how everyone used to do it. To mellow out the sound, insulate the inside of the box with some sort of dampener. Makes a huge difference in the quality. You MUST seal every crevice and opening, as even a slight air leak will hurt the performance of the sub, and quite often the hissing can be heard.
Ported boxes really didn't get popular until maybe last 10-15 years or so, where adding an internal baffle wall that wraps around the interior, creating a rectangle port vs. say a single/dual pipe port. The benefit is lower freq. and less stress on the sub, but I still find they are better suited for open areas like vans, hatches, wagons, etc. where there's little barrier the sound needs to cut through, plus you have room for the typically larger, heavier box which can sag many small car's springs, and the extra weight can negatively affect the brakes on the car.
For a 1st box, try sealed. They are lighter, take up less room, easier to build, and often allow for more power to be driven to the sub, plus they add physically restive loads to the actual woofer, which seems to act like a really high dampening effect. Use a thick 3/4" or thicker MDF so the box isn't falling apart or adding odd resonance freq. to the overall sound.
Another thing most overlook, is you can get a slightly better response by inserting a wooden box (picture a 50 gallon fish tank on it's side, with it's top pointed to the speakers) on it's side, and the bass will enter that then reflect back vs. say hitting the plastic or carpet covering the tail light area. I've done this mostly in home-systems where subs were in a closet, and it gave the same bass at 50w x 2 as many car systems at several hundred watts x 2. Can change the effect by moving box closer/further; rounding interior of box edges, etc. Makes a big difference if done right, especially if trunk is absorbing a bunch or rattling too much, etc.
Sealed boxes can be smaller, oddly shaped, etc. and provide excellent bass assuming you position your subs to face the rear of the car, so the sound waves reflect back at you. This is how everyone used to do it. To mellow out the sound, insulate the inside of the box with some sort of dampener. Makes a huge difference in the quality. You MUST seal every crevice and opening, as even a slight air leak will hurt the performance of the sub, and quite often the hissing can be heard.
Ported boxes really didn't get popular until maybe last 10-15 years or so, where adding an internal baffle wall that wraps around the interior, creating a rectangle port vs. say a single/dual pipe port. The benefit is lower freq. and less stress on the sub, but I still find they are better suited for open areas like vans, hatches, wagons, etc. where there's little barrier the sound needs to cut through, plus you have room for the typically larger, heavier box which can sag many small car's springs, and the extra weight can negatively affect the brakes on the car.
For a 1st box, try sealed. They are lighter, take up less room, easier to build, and often allow for more power to be driven to the sub, plus they add physically restive loads to the actual woofer, which seems to act like a really high dampening effect. Use a thick 3/4" or thicker MDF so the box isn't falling apart or adding odd resonance freq. to the overall sound.
Another thing most overlook, is you can get a slightly better response by inserting a wooden box (picture a 50 gallon fish tank on it's side, with it's top pointed to the speakers) on it's side, and the bass will enter that then reflect back vs. say hitting the plastic or carpet covering the tail light area. I've done this mostly in home-systems where subs were in a closet, and it gave the same bass at 50w x 2 as many car systems at several hundred watts x 2. Can change the effect by moving box closer/further; rounding interior of box edges, etc. Makes a big difference if done right, especially if trunk is absorbing a bunch or rattling too much, etc.
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You could improve the low end reproduction by using the Maxxbass 101 or similar devices (Orion made them also some time ago). It works not as the Epicenter, but is based on the psychoacoustic phenomena. Try to google Wave Audio company from Israel... I have such a device for my home stereo system and I was quite amazed with the results. You could hear up till 1,5 octaves lower without stressing your subwoofer and amplifier.
Ported or sealed box? There is no simple question, as each solution has it own positive and negative sides.
As it was mentioned before - if it is the 1. time you are trying to make a box - sealed might be a good decision if you are quite confident with the tools for wood treatment. Sealed (not close, but sealed) box should be 100% tight, meaning that there is no any even small passage for air to come through. For a sealed box you should worry about one major parameter - its volume (based on ACTUAL T/S-parameters). On the other hand a ported box will demand calculation of two parameters: box volume and port length.
Ported box does not demand such a building quality. It is bigger, but could be easily fabricated by an unskilled person. But here coming a new question - port tuning. You will need a sound generator or a number of sine waves files for optimizing the port length. There are many videos on youtube explaining how to tune the port. Some of them are very helpfull indeed.
Infrasonic filter for the ported box is simply "must to have" if one intends to play music loudly.
When chosing between ported and sealed solution, one should not forget the transfer function of the car, which is unique, but could be predicted with a certain accuracy. Such function will support the low end reproduction and might help the sealed box to play flat down to very low frequencies. Ported box will go down more quickly.
Actually - there are many other parameters to be taken into account: car size, subwoofer placement, type of a car (for sedan it might be better with the free-air solution), just to mention few. Not to forget music ganre. I personally will prefer 10" in a sealed box for jazz music, but people have their own previlleges and tastes.
As it was mentioned before - if it is the 1. time you are trying to make a box - sealed might be a good decision if you are quite confident with the tools for wood treatment. Sealed (not close, but sealed) box should be 100% tight, meaning that there is no any even small passage for air to come through. For a sealed box you should worry about one major parameter - its volume (based on ACTUAL T/S-parameters). On the other hand a ported box will demand calculation of two parameters: box volume and port length.
Ported box does not demand such a building quality. It is bigger, but could be easily fabricated by an unskilled person. But here coming a new question - port tuning. You will need a sound generator or a number of sine waves files for optimizing the port length. There are many videos on youtube explaining how to tune the port. Some of them are very helpfull indeed.
Infrasonic filter for the ported box is simply "must to have" if one intends to play music loudly.
When chosing between ported and sealed solution, one should not forget the transfer function of the car, which is unique, but could be predicted with a certain accuracy. Such function will support the low end reproduction and might help the sealed box to play flat down to very low frequencies. Ported box will go down more quickly.
Actually - there are many other parameters to be taken into account: car size, subwoofer placement, type of a car (for sedan it might be better with the free-air solution), just to mention few. Not to forget music ganre. I personally will prefer 10" in a sealed box for jazz music, but people have their own previlleges and tastes.
Those 15's look nice, I really wanted some of those older Kickers 15 years ago but never did get any. Ended up with the silver 2005 CVR12's which were decent, were loud in 2.5 cu.ft per sub tuned to 35hz and sounded very nice overall. (you seen my vids on youtube over the years, fellow Rockford lover 😉.
I say sell the prefab box they are in for $15 - $20 on craigslist and use that money for some wood / materials. Doesn't take much wood working skill to get a good working usable box, perhaps not the prettiest, but functional!
Many Home Depot's / Lowe's will cut wood for you, just ask them. You need to have the exact sizes for all the panels you want cut and as Perry said they may not be 100% exact cuts, though it would be close enough. You can usually find budget jigsaw's / circular saws cheap, check craigslist, you'll probably need one to cut the sub hole.
I'd port them; knowing you like high output from seeing your vids over the years I think you'd be happier tuned around 35 to 40hz. These are a little older than the manual posted in the thread, but they should have the older manual on their site if you have the model on the sticker, not sure if the 2007 one is close enough.
This is assuming you still have these and haven't got it done already or sold them.
You didn't post any vids of these on youtube!😀
I say sell the prefab box they are in for $15 - $20 on craigslist and use that money for some wood / materials. Doesn't take much wood working skill to get a good working usable box, perhaps not the prettiest, but functional!
Many Home Depot's / Lowe's will cut wood for you, just ask them. You need to have the exact sizes for all the panels you want cut and as Perry said they may not be 100% exact cuts, though it would be close enough. You can usually find budget jigsaw's / circular saws cheap, check craigslist, you'll probably need one to cut the sub hole.
I'd port them; knowing you like high output from seeing your vids over the years I think you'd be happier tuned around 35 to 40hz. These are a little older than the manual posted in the thread, but they should have the older manual on their site if you have the model on the sticker, not sure if the 2007 one is close enough.
This is assuming you still have these and haven't got it done already or sold them.
You didn't post any vids of these on youtube!😀
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