About 20 years ago I bought a pair of the original version of PMC's DB1 loudspeakers, from a local hifi shop which has since closed.
Over the years I've really enjoyed using them both for recreational listening, as well as for more critical recording and mixing purposes. I've also driven them to extremely loud volumes on the odd occasion, but never for long and definitely never to the point where I could hear any strain put upon them. These speakers have done sterling service, hence I'd like to replace the broken parts and get them back to good as new condition.
I recently let a very close friend use them when I was away for work. They conceded that "partying" got out of hand, but that the DB1s did a great job turning my front room into a dancefloor, with a solid 12+ hours of duty pumping out loud trance and hard techno.
I've no idea if was that which took its toll, but I was told that once folks had calmed down and started coming down - the deep organic bass from tunes like Spiritualized's epic Come Together and Cop Shoot Cop was turned up sufficiently loud to horribly shred one LF driver, whilst presumably burning out the voice coil on the other (which no longer works) before any physical damage could appear.
I contacted PMC direct, but was shocked to find that once VAT and shipping are accounted for, they charge nearly £500 just for a pair of their replacement drivers!
I originally only paid around that amount for these fine speakers. The manager offered me an extremely decent discount on his lightly shop-soiled pair of the hifi version, explaining he'd only sold the regulation black studio model since their release.
I've found threads here that suggest the correct replacement drivers are Vifa M13WG-08-09, but outside of buying a fully functional used pair - I've had no luck locating those replacement drivers anywhere.
The closest I've come is an Australian vendor who offers the M13SG for around AUS$90 each, before shipping, taxes etc. My understanding is those drivers are replacements for the DB1 models with the S suffix, denoting the magnetic shielding required way back when we still had huge CRT televisions. I'd be happy with that option at a fair price, but I'm located on the UK mainland. These would have to be transported from Australia...the irony of which nevertheless still makes me chuckle!
Can anyone here help me find some version of the correct LF driver for a DB1, that doesn't involve shipping them half way around the world, or paying the high prices that PMC themselves demand?
Has anyone else who is invested in PMC encountered a similar situation, either with the DB1 variations or another model? If so, were you able to buy replacement drivers at a reasonable price, or forced to pay the high prices charged when buying from PMC themselves?
Any and all help and advice will be gratefully recieved!
Over the years I've really enjoyed using them both for recreational listening, as well as for more critical recording and mixing purposes. I've also driven them to extremely loud volumes on the odd occasion, but never for long and definitely never to the point where I could hear any strain put upon them. These speakers have done sterling service, hence I'd like to replace the broken parts and get them back to good as new condition.
I recently let a very close friend use them when I was away for work. They conceded that "partying" got out of hand, but that the DB1s did a great job turning my front room into a dancefloor, with a solid 12+ hours of duty pumping out loud trance and hard techno.
I've no idea if was that which took its toll, but I was told that once folks had calmed down and started coming down - the deep organic bass from tunes like Spiritualized's epic Come Together and Cop Shoot Cop was turned up sufficiently loud to horribly shred one LF driver, whilst presumably burning out the voice coil on the other (which no longer works) before any physical damage could appear.
I contacted PMC direct, but was shocked to find that once VAT and shipping are accounted for, they charge nearly £500 just for a pair of their replacement drivers!
I originally only paid around that amount for these fine speakers. The manager offered me an extremely decent discount on his lightly shop-soiled pair of the hifi version, explaining he'd only sold the regulation black studio model since their release.
I've found threads here that suggest the correct replacement drivers are Vifa M13WG-08-09, but outside of buying a fully functional used pair - I've had no luck locating those replacement drivers anywhere.
The closest I've come is an Australian vendor who offers the M13SG for around AUS$90 each, before shipping, taxes etc. My understanding is those drivers are replacements for the DB1 models with the S suffix, denoting the magnetic shielding required way back when we still had huge CRT televisions. I'd be happy with that option at a fair price, but I'm located on the UK mainland. These would have to be transported from Australia...the irony of which nevertheless still makes me chuckle!
Can anyone here help me find some version of the correct LF driver for a DB1, that doesn't involve shipping them half way around the world, or paying the high prices that PMC themselves demand?
Has anyone else who is invested in PMC encountered a similar situation, either with the DB1 variations or another model? If so, were you able to buy replacement drivers at a reasonable price, or forced to pay the high prices charged when buying from PMC themselves?
Any and all help and advice will be gratefully recieved!
I would take a look at seas er15 woofer. The impedance line is nearly the same as vifa m13 and sensitivity is similar to er25 as well. Only outside diameter a bit wider.
have a chat with either Wilmslow audio or Falcon acoustics they both usually stock older Seas/Vifa models.
Contact Neil or Steve at Wilmslow Audio - they do a lot of work sourcing drivers for older designs
https://wilmslowaudio.co.uk
The other one to try is Falcon
https://www.falconacoustics.co.uk
https://wilmslowaudio.co.uk
The other one to try is Falcon
https://www.falconacoustics.co.uk
Mind you, a NOS M13WG probably needs new Kurt Müller surrounds. I know mine do. This is a recent impedance plot of one of the four. Could be that the spider has had it too.
Apologies for not responding to this thread until now. Unfortunately a close family member was taken ill almost immediately after my original post.
Thank you so much for providing those contacts, I couldn't find anything suitable on either site so I've sent messages to both explaining my situation.
So far I've only had a response from Jerry Bloomfield at Falcon. He advised that Vifa stopped making their 13cm drivers around a decade ago, hence he was pretty certain that OEM units from PMC are now my only option.
Hopefully Wilmslow Audio will get back to me soon, if not I'll try another method of communication.
Thanks, that was actually the site I found selling the shielded version in Australia.
Unfortunately their website doesn't offer an option to ship to the UK, but having converted their price to £sterling and seen that it works out pretty inexpensive - I have enquired as to whether they are willing to ship to the UK. Hopefully they will reply to me soon.
The thing about being down under works like this-
Things takes ages to get to us. Like years: Sometimes never.
TheDayrin RSS315HFA-8 appeared in Australia in 2021, a decade after it was released.
And given our market is pretty small (just 42M people sparsely distributed in Australia, New Zealand, Papua New Guinea and surrounding islands in the Pacific Ocean) things don’t really fly off the shelf. So when HQ decides that things will be discontinued, guess who has stock? This is why we still have Vifa and Peerless NOS here in Australia.
PMC probably hold old stock for spare parts. The older the part the more expensive it becomes to get. My guess is if you wanted a relatively modern part, it would cost less than the old part.
Things takes ages to get to us. Like years: Sometimes never.
TheDayrin RSS315HFA-8 appeared in Australia in 2021, a decade after it was released.
And given our market is pretty small (just 42M people sparsely distributed in Australia, New Zealand, Papua New Guinea and surrounding islands in the Pacific Ocean) things don’t really fly off the shelf. So when HQ decides that things will be discontinued, guess who has stock? This is why we still have Vifa and Peerless NOS here in Australia.
PMC probably hold old stock for spare parts. The older the part the more expensive it becomes to get. My guess is if you wanted a relatively modern part, it would cost less than the old part.
Never buy replacements from OEM's: those "brand names" e.g. Wilson, PMC etc. charge at least 3-5 times the regular item price.
There are some on ebay usa https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fr...cat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_odkw=vifa+m13&_osacat=0
Lets not forget the shelving price.
As in, what does it cost a business to hold slow moving stock on a shelf that could be used for fast moving stock.
If you make $1 profit per item, and the items take up the same space, then would you rather sell 5 a year, or 5,000 a year ?
Floor lease prices are always going up. And if you've bought the space, then it has to pay back the outlay.
I've worked in industries using chemicals that were banned in every other country at least 15 years earlier because they were known carcinogens.
Who here has seen the horror videos of large ship demolition.
As in, what does it cost a business to hold slow moving stock on a shelf that could be used for fast moving stock.
If you make $1 profit per item, and the items take up the same space, then would you rather sell 5 a year, or 5,000 a year ?
Floor lease prices are always going up. And if you've bought the space, then it has to pay back the outlay.
I've worked in industries using chemicals that were banned in every other country at least 15 years earlier because they were known carcinogens.
Who here has seen the horror videos of large ship demolition.
spot on @UserAbuser
We dump our **** to our other countries because we don't want to deal with it eg. uranium, plastics, e-waste...
That video makes my blood boil.
And Australia, like America, now wants to bring back manufacturing.
Well, why don't we start with and taking our **** back? And recycling/remanufacturing?
We dump our **** to our other countries because we don't want to deal with it eg. uranium, plastics, e-waste...
That video makes my blood boil.
And Australia, like America, now wants to bring back manufacturing.
Well, why don't we start with and taking our **** back? And recycling/remanufacturing?
Thanks very much for that. Unfortunately that seller only has the 16R version, whereas the stock speaker used in the DB1 is a nominal 8R driver. Hence I'd be worried about the effect of changing the impedance in terms of the driver interacting with the bespoke passive crossover network.
My understanding from working with PA systems is that passive crossovers are designed for the specific impedance curve of the drivers involved. I assume that would be no different in principle for hifi and monitor type designs, and that if anything they would be more sensitive to such a deviation from spec.
However I'd be grateful to learn what folks with experience of integrating drivers with passive crossovers would think, in respect of using a 16R LF driver in place of the original 8R version. Is this something that would be recommended in these particular circumstances? If so, that US seller could be extremely helpful, assuming shipping and import duties don't make it prohibitively expensive.
There are two listings. This guy seems to have the 8ohm
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fr...cat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_odkw=vifa+m13&_osacat=0
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fr...cat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_odkw=vifa+m13&_osacat=0
@motokok (for some reason your post doesn't let me quote you!)
Many thanks once again. However I clicked that link and it took me straight to the exact same listing as before. He doesn't use the full model designation (ie misses the final 2 digits) which is 16 for the M13SG 16R model, but his listing title very clearly states "16 Ohms" so I had a good look about to see if I could find anything better.
I searched all of his listings and there was only one Vifa M13, the 16R version. I tried some wider searches but nothing came up.
If you see a listing for the 8R model, please could you post the direct link? The search link only shows me a listing with "16 Ohms" very clearly stated in the title.
Many thanks once again. However I clicked that link and it took me straight to the exact same listing as before. He doesn't use the full model designation (ie misses the final 2 digits) which is 16 for the M13SG 16R model, but his listing title very clearly states "16 Ohms" so I had a good look about to see if I could find anything better.
I searched all of his listings and there was only one Vifa M13, the 16R version. I tried some wider searches but nothing came up.
If you see a listing for the 8R model, please could you post the direct link? The search link only shows me a listing with "16 Ohms" very clearly stated in the title.