Has anyone used spray paint on wood with the intention of keeping the grain visible?
What problems did you run into?
I am making bases for gem stone cutting machines so this is not furniture. When I got the contract was a simple stain and poly job.
Now the color scheme of the machine is being updated from
to black on black. Black stain looks washed out and is hard for me to keep from being blotchy across the several applications to get a deep color. I can add pigment to the stain but in my mind I am just adding solids to the oil based stain, you know, i'm making paint that is a hassle to apply.
Why not just skip the hassle and use spray enamel?
I'm looking for critique . Why might this be a bad idea?
Jeremy
What problems did you run into?
I am making bases for gem stone cutting machines so this is not furniture. When I got the contract was a simple stain and poly job.
Now the color scheme of the machine is being updated from
Why not just skip the hassle and use spray enamel?
I'm looking for critique . Why might this be a bad idea?
Jeremy
Assuming I follow, I just sprayed/wiped till I got the desired tint/grain trade-off, then sealed.
I'd seal with shellac and use a gel wipe on black stain. There are other wood conditioners that control blotchy absorption but clear shellac has always worked for me. Always nail down your application on a test piece first. Multiple small test pieces are even better for comparing variations side by side.
I like to use wood dye rather than stain, it runs in deeper and you get a consistent color. You can still see its wood just based on the harder and softer parts of the grain pattern but color is true black with more of a sheen difference than a color difference.
If it's for the same price as you quoted when you were awarded the contract, I'd keep it to the same number of steps. One coat black stain + two coat tinted varnish, which is about as basic as stain finishes get. First varnish coat might need a deeper tint than the second.
Ebony finishes are harder to do. I wouldn't do any more than that unless the price was renegotiated.
Ebony finishes are harder to do. I wouldn't do any more than that unless the price was renegotiated.
If the wood does not take stain or dye well and is blotchy
Usually use Wood conditioner for first coat.
Then apply the stain / dye after conditioner.
Common issues is the wood might have a high moisture level.
So it blotches with oil based products.
Or sanding is uneven.
As far as a zillion magical dyes and stains out there.
Make your own.
Buy a can of oil based black and add mineral spirits or paint thinner.
And make your own " custom" shade.
make sure wood is dry as possible, easy now it is getting hot.
Or "condition" it. Which is wipe it down with naphtha first.
Naphtha is slightly more volatile, basically dries faster.
And can dry out wood. which is what you want cause the moisture
in it can blotch the oil.
or buy magically brand name stuff with pretty labels.
For a " dark " stain....paint it
then wipe it like a dye or stain.
which is paint with more solvent.
and other nonsense stuff like boiled blah blah oil
and many others.
Aka hard drying oils that guarantee the blotches dont wipe out.
So basically paint, add a little solvent.
and you have a dark stain.
or light stain, based on your mix.
Usually use Wood conditioner for first coat.
Then apply the stain / dye after conditioner.
Common issues is the wood might have a high moisture level.
So it blotches with oil based products.
Or sanding is uneven.
As far as a zillion magical dyes and stains out there.
Make your own.
Buy a can of oil based black and add mineral spirits or paint thinner.
And make your own " custom" shade.
make sure wood is dry as possible, easy now it is getting hot.
Or "condition" it. Which is wipe it down with naphtha first.
Naphtha is slightly more volatile, basically dries faster.
And can dry out wood. which is what you want cause the moisture
in it can blotch the oil.
or buy magically brand name stuff with pretty labels.
For a " dark " stain....paint it
then wipe it like a dye or stain.
which is paint with more solvent.
and other nonsense stuff like boiled blah blah oil
and many others.
Aka hard drying oils that guarantee the blotches dont wipe out.
So basically paint, add a little solvent.
and you have a dark stain.
or light stain, based on your mix.
Smart people in case your not interested in this novel of a post can you tell me if you think the solvents in wipe on poly will re-melt cheap enamel spray paint?
Let me be more specific as the topic of the thread has morphed from
"Why not just skip the hassle and use spray enamel?
I'm looking for critique . Why might this be a bad idea?"
Over to staining techniques. This is great as I love the knowledge and the conversation but while not being Off Topic it is Topic adjacent.
First off we are dealing with Red Oak plywood so it is open poor species group. (red oak is not a tree it is a group of trees.)
If you over sand the wood you will cause some weird things as the grain is very pronounced or large or rough.
So it's 150grit with the grain for good results.
Conditioner is great for softer woods as it reduces the amount of absorption of the softer areas of the wood by increasing the moisture content of those areas. While keeping the finish consistent it will be lighter. I am trying to achieve a very dark color on hard wood so conditioner is right out.
And then there is the hassle of staining to a defined color in the medium batch, small shop environment. What I mean is that with the old situation I only had to match the finish to the siblings of a particular order. If someone ordered 2 machines then I just stain the 2 bases with the same light to medium shade and all is good.
Now I have to try and match all bases going forward. This is why I am moving over to paint.
In painting terms I feel that I can spray some medium hot flat (not much of a choice but aerosols are hot.) Then wipe on some cool(drying temp) poly with the sheen the customer wants. I'm not sure about spray poly as I don't know how hot it is.
Smart people can you tell me if you think the solvents in wipe on poly will re-melt cheap enamel spray paint?
At any rate here are some pictures of the stained panels pre poly and a panel with a single coat of gloss black spray.
Jeremy
The multi time zone of this forum makes me feel like I'm in deep space! It's awesome.
I am in total agreement.
Let me be more specific as the topic of the thread has morphed from
"Why not just skip the hassle and use spray enamel?
I'm looking for critique . Why might this be a bad idea?"
Over to staining techniques. This is great as I love the knowledge and the conversation but while not being Off Topic it is Topic adjacent.
First off we are dealing with Red Oak plywood so it is open poor species group. (red oak is not a tree it is a group of trees.)
If you over sand the wood you will cause some weird things as the grain is very pronounced or large or rough.
So it's 150grit with the grain for good results.
Conditioner is great for softer woods as it reduces the amount of absorption of the softer areas of the wood by increasing the moisture content of those areas. While keeping the finish consistent it will be lighter. I am trying to achieve a very dark color on hard wood so conditioner is right out.
And then there is the hassle of staining to a defined color in the medium batch, small shop environment. What I mean is that with the old situation I only had to match the finish to the siblings of a particular order. If someone ordered 2 machines then I just stain the 2 bases with the same light to medium shade and all is good.
Now I have to try and match all bases going forward. This is why I am moving over to paint.
In painting terms I feel that I can spray some medium hot flat (not much of a choice but aerosols are hot.) Then wipe on some cool(drying temp) poly with the sheen the customer wants. I'm not sure about spray poly as I don't know how hot it is.
Smart people can you tell me if you think the solvents in wipe on poly will re-melt cheap enamel spray paint?
At any rate here are some pictures of the stained panels pre poly and a panel with a single coat of gloss black spray.
Jeremy
The multi time zone of this forum makes me feel like I'm in deep space! It's awesome.
Paint has no depth, it sits on the surface with little to no penetration. But it's quick and easy and this isn't fine furniture, so if the customer is happy that's all that matters.
Aniline dye is beautiful on any wood, even red oak. But, water based stain is problematic as it raises the grain. There's a workaround but it involves more steps.
Wipe on poly as top coat for spray paint. Any comments?
The Idea is to form some durability to the finish.
Jeremy
The Idea is to form some durability to the finish.
Jeremy
Homestead Finishes Transtint liquid. From Homestead https://homesteadfinishingproducts.com/transtint-liquid-dyes/ or at fine stores everywhere. 20 bucks. A few drops'll do ya.