Hello everyone! I've had this "quirk" for as long as I have memory, and I've always been extremely sensitive to the mid-treble and presence frequency range. My speakers and headphone measure good, but they all sound shrill to my ears especially when I raise the volume. I don't mean that kind of loud that blows your eardrums out, just the "sorta loud" most people usually listen music to.
I sort of hear a "ringing" sound like the one of a high-Q peaking filter at around 2,5kHz. This can't be the speakers or the room as I hear this on almost every system including headphones. The same systems also sound "fine" to other people.
I also have a problem going to concerts without earplugs. When things start to get too loud for me I sort of hear a "saturation" sound like the one from when you overdrive the amplifier, but it goes away as soon as I put the earplugs in so I know it's not the amplification. Again, I had friends with me who told me that they could hear just fine.
Usually, I counter this EQing out that range (from 2kHz to about 3.5kHz) by about -5 or -6dB which I realize is a lot! At that point I can raise the volume even more, so I'm not just compensating by making the signal quieter.
Besides that, my earing is good. I can hear to almost 19kHz which should be normal for a 22 year old. I don't suffer from tinnitus and a specialist checked my earing and said I'm fine!
Does anyone have such a sensitive earing as mine? Do you have any ideas about what could be the cause of it?
I sort of hear a "ringing" sound like the one of a high-Q peaking filter at around 2,5kHz. This can't be the speakers or the room as I hear this on almost every system including headphones. The same systems also sound "fine" to other people.
I also have a problem going to concerts without earplugs. When things start to get too loud for me I sort of hear a "saturation" sound like the one from when you overdrive the amplifier, but it goes away as soon as I put the earplugs in so I know it's not the amplification. Again, I had friends with me who told me that they could hear just fine.
Usually, I counter this EQing out that range (from 2kHz to about 3.5kHz) by about -5 or -6dB which I realize is a lot! At that point I can raise the volume even more, so I'm not just compensating by making the signal quieter.
Besides that, my earing is good. I can hear to almost 19kHz which should be normal for a 22 year old. I don't suffer from tinnitus and a specialist checked my earing and said I'm fine!
Does anyone have such a sensitive earing as mine? Do you have any ideas about what could be the cause of it?
If you look at the Fletcher-Munson curves, that's kind of a feature for normal undamaged hearing.
Those with hearing loss probably lose it. Keep protecting your hearing, you won't regret it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal-loudness_contour
Those with hearing loss probably lose it. Keep protecting your hearing, you won't regret it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal-loudness_contour
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It's probably a warning that things are too loud. It could also be an indication of hearing damage that has already occurred. A visit to an otologist probably is a good idea.
Thanks. Yes it's actually an otologist who checked my hearing. I passed it and she said that my earing was good.
I did know of this, however if I'm reading the graph correctly the presence should actually stick out less the louder you go, but it is like the complete opposite to me.
I guess it makes sense that those with earing loss are less sensitive to high frequencies, but for reference every "good" measuring pair speaker of speakers I've tried (i.e. flat response outside or slightly tilted down in-room) always require EQ to bring the mid treble down even with reference speakers which should definitely not sound fatiguing.
Since I'm the only one being fatigued so easily I think it's something most people don't experience.
Also I've to say that the "ringing" I am talking about sounds like a peak in the frequency response.
Maybe "ringing" it's not the right word as it can gets confused with the ringing of tinnitus. Even in complete silence (at night wearing ear plugs) I don't ear anything unusual. And my hearing tested ok.
Maybe "ringing" it's not the right word as it can gets confused with the ringing of tinnitus. Even in complete silence (at night wearing ear plugs) I don't ear anything unusual. And my hearing tested ok.
i think i have a similar condition, i always cut 2-5k by up to 10db,i have pretty good hearing but I struggle with comprehending speech
Human hearing is extremely sensitive between 2 kHz and 4 kHz. If boosted, this range can produce listening fatigue.
Your hearing may just be a bit more sensitive than the norm, especially as you say you've had this "quirk" as long as you've had memory.
i know that,just seems some poeple are fine with flat speakers at low volumes,I prefer flat at war levels(think 100db speakers on 50-100w at a meter away)
However, reproducing needs to be natural. You don't go equalising speakers to suit every individual.
More likely the speakers have a problem. EG...
1. Wide tweeter crosses to narrow woofer top end and comes in with heavy power at the cross.
2. Diffraction gets worse when loud.
3. Equalising here to create false 'detail'.
4. Designer went for flat response, instead of a proper house curve.
5. Poor crossover.
More likely the speakers have a problem. EG...
1. Wide tweeter crosses to narrow woofer top end and comes in with heavy power at the cross.
2. Diffraction gets worse when loud.
3. Equalising here to create false 'detail'.
4. Designer went for flat response, instead of a proper house curve.
5. Poor crossover.
I have no problems understanding speech (well given if I'm paying attention lol) and doing various tasks. This is what bothers me. I can't explain it. If I had hearing damage it would be easy to explain it to myself.
Some speakers are indeed way worse than others... I have the same problem with most headphones.
For example despite all their obvious limits (they're not hifi at all) the ones I like the most under this regard are the Apple AirPods Pro IEM. Or my car's stereo which I tuned it with DSP to have a dip around that frequency. I can crank the volume and still enjoy the music.
While both the B&W DM604S1 or the Ciare Cerisier kit I own sound incredible at low to medium volumes, when I turn them up they quickly become fatiguing. The B&W being worse in that regard. Other speakers I tried had the same outcome.
Headphones wise... Grado SR325e, Pioneer SE-4, Pioneer SE-A1000, Beyerdynamic DT770 and 990, and the HyperX Cloud Revolver headset all have this problem. Pretty much all the headphones I've listened to. Some are worse than others.
Some sound really great at medium volume but they torture me as soon as I turn them up.
I think that unless one's using really bad speakers (or very small drivers) and power compression is changing the frequency response when raising the volume, if a speaker measures flat at low volume it should be also flat at higher levels.
Thanks. I agree as I shouldn't use EQ for this, under the hypothesis that I don't hear things differently than most people do.
Some speakers are indeed way worse than others... I have the same problem with most headphones.
For example despite all their obvious limits (they're not hifi at all) the ones I like the most under this regard are the Apple AirPods Pro IEM. Or my car's stereo which I tuned it with DSP to have a dip around that frequency. I can crank the volume and still enjoy the music.
While both the B&W DM604S1 or the Ciare Cerisier kit I own sound incredible at low to medium volumes, when I turn them up they quickly become fatiguing. The B&W being worse in that regard. Other speakers I tried had the same outcome.
Headphones wise... Grado SR325e, Pioneer SE-4, Pioneer SE-A1000, Beyerdynamic DT770 and 990, and the HyperX Cloud Revolver headset all have this problem. Pretty much all the headphones I've listened to. Some are worse than others.
Some sound really great at medium volume but they torture me as soon as I turn them up.
I started to really get into music when I was 14, and at that time I had a very basic understanding of how speakers worked since I was basically still a kid, but I remember getting annoyed by the treble when turning up the volume.
There are many products I don't like either.
When sold commercially, having a standout sound about them helps to maintain consistency. There's the idea that it's just about grabbing attention but I'm not so sure, after all when you use knowledge and experience to build a speaker and room into a natural sounding system, it can sound unattractive if you take it out of its environment without painstakingly setting it up properly again. There is something about a speaker having an 'edge' to it that can partially (but incorrectly) compensate for compromised setup.
When sold commercially, having a standout sound about them helps to maintain consistency. There's the idea that it's just about grabbing attention but I'm not so sure, after all when you use knowledge and experience to build a speaker and room into a natural sounding system, it can sound unattractive if you take it out of its environment without painstakingly setting it up properly again. There is something about a speaker having an 'edge' to it that can partially (but incorrectly) compensate for compromised setup.
I am in my 50s and I am still sensitive to this same frequency region, even though I always listen at moderate volume levels. I've dealt with it in the past by running digital room correction (Acourate) with a dip centered around 3 kHz in my target curve. Sometimes I still have to do so depending on the speakers I am listening to. However, since getting into the hobby of building some of the designs highlighted in this website, I was able to find combinations that present a lot of beautiful detail while still presenting a smooth response that doesn't bother my ears whatsoever, without resorting to EQ. So I tend to think that a lot of commercial gear is voiced to be impressive in the short term, while being less conducive to long term enjoyment.
No. We can be hyper-sensitive to level.
Compared to a lot of people, a little hyper just around 2.5kHz is "no problem". She sees folks with 30dB loss from 2K on up. Some still in denial. That does not negate your difficulty.
If you do any mowing or sawing, these work well and are inexpensive.
If you have lived with CRT displays you are likely to now have a dead spot in your hearing at the scan frequency.
Your hearing will try to compensate with two sensitive bits either side of the worn out frequency in later life.
the exact frequency will depend on the horizontal refresh rate of TV screens between countries.
Movie projectors clattered and TVs whistled in the old days. It was just part of life.
Your hearing will try to compensate with two sensitive bits either side of the worn out frequency in later life.
the exact frequency will depend on the horizontal refresh rate of TV screens between countries.
Movie projectors clattered and TVs whistled in the old days. It was just part of life.
I suffer from this effect, and I can even experience it when whistling to myself when the effect seems to me almost in the skull rather than the ears. it appears to be independent of source quality and the level at which it occurs changes randomly. I am 61, no tinnitus and with an upper limit of about 15kHz, having always carefully protected my hearing, much to the amusement of my friends at AC/DC gigs... I am not aware of the effect at normal levels, but at higher but not excessive spl the impression is of a distorted and narrow peak - almost like clipping - in the upper midrange difficult to pinpoint frequency-wise. I really cannot decide if this is a mechanical resonance trait in the ear or a psychoacoustic one, and currently seems less noticeable. It's interesting that you and I at such different ages notice the same effect, which I have never before seen mentioned, and it would be interesting if this post reveals the reason behind it.
In closing, I cannot stress strongly enough to folks to protect their hearing as once it's gone it's gone, and it's worth the slight hassle and sometimes gentle derision in order to avoid the inevitable.
Thanks for the many responses. I looked up what hyperacusis is and I can say that I wasn't aware a similar condition existed. It's still weird for me but if I have it chances are I may have been born with it. But it seems way more extreme than what I experience. I've never been exposed to loud sounds for extended periods of time.
We had CRT TVs when I still was a little child, they disappeared from any place I frequented regularly when I was 12. I remember them buzzing slightly at a very high pitch. I didn't find them particularly annoying, it was just "curious" to me. Even then I barely spent any time watching TV.
There's still the chance that, as AllenB suggested, all the speakers I've listened to were set up wrong or just incapable of producing higher SPL while maintaning a clean sound and I'm just more sensitive to distortion. And most amplifiers and headphones are not capable of producing that levels as well.
Thinking about it, the AirPods Pro have their own amplifier built inside.
Last concert I've been to, a heavy metal one, sounded like the speakers where blown out. But as soon as I put earplugs everything sorted out and became way more enjoyable.
Since you mentioned AC/DC it makes me think if you noticed it because the guitars sounded piercing. That's how I noticed it. It's mainly on guitar, but also high pitched vocals.
My ear plugs provide 37dB of reduction (3M 1100). One could argue that part of the reason of my relief when wearing them is because they attenuate they high frequency more than the low frequency, shifting the tonal balance.
I think I had minimal exposure to damaging sounds compared to other people. Haven't been to lots of concerts, they were mainly rock or metal, but I always wear earplugs or sit so far away from the PA that I can still talk to someone without shouting. Never shot a gun/used a chainsaw or other loud tools. I recently got a motorcycle but it's quiet and I wear earplugs when I go on longer rides to reduce the wind noise.
We had CRT TVs when I still was a little child, they disappeared from any place I frequented regularly when I was 12. I remember them buzzing slightly at a very high pitch. I didn't find them particularly annoying, it was just "curious" to me. Even then I barely spent any time watching TV.
There's still the chance that, as AllenB suggested, all the speakers I've listened to were set up wrong or just incapable of producing higher SPL while maintaning a clean sound and I'm just more sensitive to distortion. And most amplifiers and headphones are not capable of producing that levels as well.
Thinking about it, the AirPods Pro have their own amplifier built inside.
This is exactly how it feels like. But it very level-dependant and while there's no "single" frequency that bothers me I can identify a broader range.
Last concert I've been to, a heavy metal one, sounded like the speakers where blown out. But as soon as I put earplugs everything sorted out and became way more enjoyable.
Since you mentioned AC/DC it makes me think if you noticed it because the guitars sounded piercing. That's how I noticed it. It's mainly on guitar, but also high pitched vocals.
My ear plugs provide 37dB of reduction (3M 1100). One could argue that part of the reason of my relief when wearing them is because they attenuate they high frequency more than the low frequency, shifting the tonal balance.
I think I had minimal exposure to damaging sounds compared to other people. Haven't been to lots of concerts, they were mainly rock or metal, but I always wear earplugs or sit so far away from the PA that I can still talk to someone without shouting. Never shot a gun/used a chainsaw or other loud tools. I recently got a motorcycle but it's quiet and I wear earplugs when I go on longer rides to reduce the wind noise.
When I was in my 20's I had similar problems, beyond a certain vol., mid/upper started to sound hard and uncomfortable. It wasn't that I perceived them as louder, just they were uncomfortable listening. It's never entirely gone away (I'm in my 60's). Even the slightest trace of sibilance or 'spit' on vocals is still hard to bear. It tried the usual thing of mixn 'n' match of kit and never really got away from it. Also badly turned FM/AM where there's very slight distortion used to drive me mad.
My hearing has been tested and, while I suffer from the usual oldies h/f suckout, it's pretty good. I always put it down to the way my brain is, and that sound perceptions are partly training/experience and like any other sensation, very much a YMMV kind of thing. Think Chromesthesia or other forms of synaesthesia.
My hearing has been tested and, while I suffer from the usual oldies h/f suckout, it's pretty good. I always put it down to the way my brain is, and that sound perceptions are partly training/experience and like any other sensation, very much a YMMV kind of thing. Think Chromesthesia or other forms of synaesthesia.