Hello all ,
i'm just new here.
I'm looking for a way to get an electrical sound signal ,
out of these displays :
https://vimeo.com/80226022
Behind each pixel (a one face plastic/one face metallic dot),
there's an electro-magnet,
that will magnetize (or the opposite) ,
the metallic black surface of each "dot" .
What's happening in the magnets is (in 3 chapters):
1 they are stable (polarized in a way) .
2 they get a very quick 24V impulse , that needs ~ 400 mA of current.
3 their polarity has been changed (or have stayed the same) .
Each board produces a dense magnetic activity.
I would like to somehow listen to that activity ,
and augment the experience we can have ,
listening to these wonderful displays.
I think about 2 options :
---> try using electric guitars microphones.
---> try using play heads from tape recorders.
i don't have a guitar right now ,
but several tape recorders ,
some of them being ready for parting out.
Would you have any clues, any suggestions,
about where to start with wiring tapeheads in the simplest way ,
in order to get a kind of mic or line level ?
I thought , maybe ,
unsoldering the head on a working, cheap, tape recorder ,
add a long cable (let's say 1meter) and see what i get,
putting the recorder on play mode ...
?
I don't have very good skills in electronics ,
i have to precise .
Thanks for your help , and reading ,
Matthieu .
PS: also,
i have a 16 channels MCI tape recorder , in spare parts (all the parts).
Each of the sixteen channels has audio cards (x4).
it's old (1971) , but doesn't seem badder than this ...
there are transformers (x2 per channel) , also.
that seems interesting , as a starting set ,and a bank of spare parts.
i'm just new here.
I'm looking for a way to get an electrical sound signal ,
out of these displays :
https://vimeo.com/80226022
Behind each pixel (a one face plastic/one face metallic dot),
there's an electro-magnet,
that will magnetize (or the opposite) ,
the metallic black surface of each "dot" .
What's happening in the magnets is (in 3 chapters):
1 they are stable (polarized in a way) .
2 they get a very quick 24V impulse , that needs ~ 400 mA of current.
3 their polarity has been changed (or have stayed the same) .
Each board produces a dense magnetic activity.
I would like to somehow listen to that activity ,
and augment the experience we can have ,
listening to these wonderful displays.
I think about 2 options :
---> try using electric guitars microphones.
---> try using play heads from tape recorders.
i don't have a guitar right now ,
but several tape recorders ,
some of them being ready for parting out.
Would you have any clues, any suggestions,
about where to start with wiring tapeheads in the simplest way ,
in order to get a kind of mic or line level ?
I thought , maybe ,
unsoldering the head on a working, cheap, tape recorder ,
add a long cable (let's say 1meter) and see what i get,
putting the recorder on play mode ...
?
I don't have very good skills in electronics ,
i have to precise .
Thanks for your help , and reading ,
Matthieu .
PS: also,
i have a 16 channels MCI tape recorder , in spare parts (all the parts).
Each of the sixteen channels has audio cards (x4).
it's old (1971) , but doesn't seem badder than this ...
there are transformers (x2 per channel) , also.
that seems interesting , as a starting set ,and a bank of spare parts.
Last edited:
another simplest first step will be to get some of these K7 equipped with a mini-jack.
And try it everywhere around dot's circuitry, to find a good spot to listen to.
there's even a connector !
then , amplification.
And try it everywhere around dot's circuitry, to find a good spot to listen to.
there's even a connector !
then , amplification.
Use a single coil guitar pickup.
Buy the cheapest you can find, a few dollars, or get a broken guitar at a pawnshop or Salvation Army.
Recording heads are the worst pickup possible, because they have narrow very focused gaps so they are quite insensitive to faraway fields.
Absolute worst case, wind as much thin wire as you can about a bolt (say from 6 to 15mm diameter) , it can be large since it does not need to fit between guitar strings and body.
Or you can pull the activation coil from a dead relay.
That said, "magnetic sound" will be boring, your video shows a very rich and detailed , full of harmonics, acoustic/mechanical sound, so a regular microphone might be more interesting.
Even a cheap electret capsule.
Buy the cheapest you can find, a few dollars, or get a broken guitar at a pawnshop or Salvation Army.
Recording heads are the worst pickup possible, because they have narrow very focused gaps so they are quite insensitive to faraway fields.
Absolute worst case, wind as much thin wire as you can about a bolt (say from 6 to 15mm diameter) , it can be large since it does not need to fit between guitar strings and body.
Or you can pull the activation coil from a dead relay.
That said, "magnetic sound" will be boring, your video shows a very rich and detailed , full of harmonics, acoustic/mechanical sound, so a regular microphone might be more interesting.
Even a cheap electret capsule.
Hey JMFahey,
many thanks for your answer.
I have found and bought yesterday night, a used 5€ humbuker (double coil) .
At this price , i can give it a try.
I'll also get a single coil, different brands , specifications, ...
what ever i can find , for cheap.
I understand why you definitely suggest avoiding tapeheads,
thanks for that clarification.
My first tries , with a big one , were unsuccessful ( plain soft noise )
And it seems so much easier to use guitar pickups .
I also understand why you say i will not get as good results as with classic microphones.
I know i'm going to get raw , cold , harsh , noisy , signals.
It has no chance to reproduce cleanly the acoustic sound .
But that's not my aim .
You're right saying that classic mics are better for that.
I'd like to hear the electrical activity .
This underworld interpretation of the score must be interesting to hear and play with.
Once i'll have some coil in the set-up , i will try to pass the signal into analog filters .
For that i have some old synthesizers and processors,
such as a Sherman Filter, that could be a good , musical , interpreter .
This will be quite experimental ,
but i hope i'll end with something nice.
I want to play it live , for an audience.
One of the advantages of using magnetic sources , instead of mics,
in a "installlation" configuration ,
is that i will not have to deal with the feedbacks that mics give me.
These dots have a wonderfull sound , but it's ve-ry shy .
Gains on my mixing desk , are nearly at the maximum.
I could deal with it , but wouldn't be free enough ,
stuck in gain , by this feedback barrier.
I want to expand the sound, and play with it , having room for it.
Modular synths , analog processors ,
there is something to do .
That's why your suggestion is of a great help !
I have in stock some SIEMENS V672-2 mutipurpose amps ,
also a Philips EL 3740 (tube mic-pre of a mid-50's tape recorder),
also a "dynacord Favorit" guitar amp ...
The multipurpose ones sure would be better amps than my 01V96i (Yamaha) mic pre's , with appropriate services on it.
But they are un-racked , or give hum , for now .
I'll post here when i have results .
Thanks a lot for your answer ,
Matthieu
many thanks for your answer.
I have found and bought yesterday night, a used 5€ humbuker (double coil) .
At this price , i can give it a try.
I'll also get a single coil, different brands , specifications, ...
what ever i can find , for cheap.
I understand why you definitely suggest avoiding tapeheads,
thanks for that clarification.
My first tries , with a big one , were unsuccessful ( plain soft noise )
And it seems so much easier to use guitar pickups .
I also understand why you say i will not get as good results as with classic microphones.
I know i'm going to get raw , cold , harsh , noisy , signals.
It has no chance to reproduce cleanly the acoustic sound .
But that's not my aim .
You're right saying that classic mics are better for that.
I'd like to hear the electrical activity .
This underworld interpretation of the score must be interesting to hear and play with.
Once i'll have some coil in the set-up , i will try to pass the signal into analog filters .
For that i have some old synthesizers and processors,
such as a Sherman Filter, that could be a good , musical , interpreter .
This will be quite experimental ,
but i hope i'll end with something nice.
I want to play it live , for an audience.
One of the advantages of using magnetic sources , instead of mics,
in a "installlation" configuration ,
is that i will not have to deal with the feedbacks that mics give me.
These dots have a wonderfull sound , but it's ve-ry shy .
Gains on my mixing desk , are nearly at the maximum.
I could deal with it , but wouldn't be free enough ,
stuck in gain , by this feedback barrier.
I want to expand the sound, and play with it , having room for it.
Modular synths , analog processors ,
there is something to do .
That's why your suggestion is of a great help !
I have in stock some SIEMENS V672-2 mutipurpose amps ,
also a Philips EL 3740 (tube mic-pre of a mid-50's tape recorder),
also a "dynacord Favorit" guitar amp ...
The multipurpose ones sure would be better amps than my 01V96i (Yamaha) mic pre's , with appropriate services on it.
But they are un-racked , or give hum , for now .
I'll post here when i have results .
Thanks a lot for your answer ,
Matthieu
yes,
absolutely .
i had tried , 2 years ago.
results were not very good, i hadn't found a significant-enough signal, only hums and buzz.
I must give it a try again , this must work, too.
absolutely .
i had tried , 2 years ago.
results were not very good, i hadn't found a significant-enough signal, only hums and buzz.
I must give it a try again , this must work, too.
Well, that´s what it is.
Just a series of squarewave pulses turning on/off individual pixels, just 2 bit resolution because it´s all it takes.
To the human ear, they will probably sound like buzz.
From what´s visible, it takes, say, 1/2 to 1/4 second per pixel flip, so a 2 to 4 Hz pulse per flip.
Multiply that by the amount of pixels and you end up with a pulse train of a few hundred Hz, *maybe* in the low kHz area if you add (needed) sync and control pulses plus deadspace to separate words.
I bet sound won´t be very different from a Modem or Fax machine signal, or a model plane command stream, played back at a much slower speed.
victory !
i have just tested some "control signal tapping" .
it's amazing.
exactly what i was looking for !!!!!
there is no noise at all, only impulse or processing activity , with different sound wether we short a source signal , a driving signal , even some pins of various components.
It is quite brutal , and looks like an old fax , that's a right.
But the energy is so huge !
I immediatly plugged an analog filter ,
and the sound became sooo nice !
...
i have to pause now ,
but will get back to it tonight .
I'll shoot the set up , record some sound,
and post it here.
Thanks a lot for your advices,
a big door has just opened in front of me.
cheers.
i have just tested some "control signal tapping" .
it's amazing.
exactly what i was looking for !!!!!
there is no noise at all, only impulse or processing activity , with different sound wether we short a source signal , a driving signal , even some pins of various components.
It is quite brutal , and looks like an old fax , that's a right.
But the energy is so huge !
I immediatly plugged an analog filter ,
and the sound became sooo nice !
...
i have to pause now ,
but will get back to it tonight .
I'll shoot the set up , record some sound,
and post it here.
Thanks a lot for your advices,
a big door has just opened in front of me.
cheers.
I have always been impressed by the "machine gun-like" sound these panels produce:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7wKObi6ud4
General characteristics of our display equipments:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7wKObi6ud4
General characteristics of our display equipments:
So ,
here is some sound.
(don't play it loud 🙂 )
many displays have slightly different styles of processing cards .
that totally changes how each circuitry "plays" the score , electronically.
it's really cool to have that expand of choice.
I particularly appreciate the sound of a single pixel flipping, in the first part.
I have to get back to it ,
i want to try to hear 12 displays like that in the same time .
I have to cable for a few hours ...
but may have some other questions , concerning audio , later,
if you don't mind .
Thanks for your readings and advices,
Matthieu
here is some sound.
(don't play it loud 🙂 )
many displays have slightly different styles of processing cards .
that totally changes how each circuitry "plays" the score , electronically.
it's really cool to have that expand of choice.
I particularly appreciate the sound of a single pixel flipping, in the first part.
I have to get back to it ,
i want to try to hear 12 displays like that in the same time .
I have to cable for a few hours ...
but may have some other questions , concerning audio , later,
if you don't mind .
Thanks for your readings and advices,
Matthieu
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