hi al. I have diferentdatas, and lost myself 🙁
what values I should use for 2500hz 1 order x over
and 2order(linkviz rilei) filter at 2200hz.
beter to send all data sheet 🙁 for I by myself can count..
happy x-mas
any helps welcome
what values I should use for 2500hz 1 order x over
and 2order(linkviz rilei) filter at 2200hz.
beter to send all data sheet 🙁 for I by myself can count..
happy x-mas
any helps welcome
Which drive units are you using. and when you say 1st order I assume you know this will be electrical and not acoustic. Ie the driver will add sum roll off of its own to the 1st order maybe givin as much as 3rd order.
The same goes for the 2nd order xover this will be electrical and not acoustic. Woofers usually can be made to sum 4th order with 2nd order networks. If you tell me what drivers you have got and what slopes you require acoustically (i dont think 1st will be achievable unless you have very wide bandwidth drivers), if I can get hold of some info on them, ie graphs of impedance and freq I can give you some simulated values if you like.
Happy Xmas
Matt
The same goes for the 2nd order xover this will be electrical and not acoustic. Woofers usually can be made to sum 4th order with 2nd order networks. If you tell me what drivers you have got and what slopes you require acoustically (i dont think 1st will be achievable unless you have very wide bandwidth drivers), if I can get hold of some info on them, ie graphs of impedance and freq I can give you some simulated values if you like.
Happy Xmas
Matt
thanks
sorry, I am not a proof.
I have morel mw 224 woofer and morel mtd 32 tweeter.
also I did very good quality box for them(33liter, front panel from 25mmx2 mdf)
unfortunately I have not found any datas about mw 224 🙁 but it sounds very warm, I have dynaudio mw 170, and its piece of plastic sound crap comparing to mw 224. also new morel like 220,265 has plastic membranes and I dont like sound of theese.
what means acoustical,and electrical filter.?I use 1order(?) (one cap,and one spule)
in my opinion mw 224 goes very high,about 3KHz.
sorry, I am not a proof.
I have morel mw 224 woofer and morel mtd 32 tweeter.
also I did very good quality box for them(33liter, front panel from 25mmx2 mdf)
unfortunately I have not found any datas about mw 224 🙁 but it sounds very warm, I have dynaudio mw 170, and its piece of plastic sound crap comparing to mw 224. also new morel like 220,265 has plastic membranes and I dont like sound of theese.
what means acoustical,and electrical filter.?I use 1order(?) (one cap,and one spule)
in my opinion mw 224 goes very high,about 3KHz.
OK electrical and acoustics responses.
The electrical response is what the crossover creates. for example, if the loudspeaker has a flat requency response and a constant impedance then adding a 1st order crossover will give you a 1st order crossover acoustically. What you will hear will be what you have done in the crossover.
However, if the driver has a natural roll off of 1st order type, then adding a 1st order xover will create a 2nd order roll off.
The 1st order electrical of the crossover will add to the 1st order of the driver you create a 2nd order acoutic roll off. Again what you hear will be 2nd order even though the crossover is 1st order.
The electric plus the driver = acoustics response.
As regards to the drivers, the MDT 32 tweeter is very nice and is highly regarded around these parts. I tried to find some information on the MW244 and came up with some but not enough.
Hope thats helpful Matt
The electrical response is what the crossover creates. for example, if the loudspeaker has a flat requency response and a constant impedance then adding a 1st order crossover will give you a 1st order crossover acoustically. What you will hear will be what you have done in the crossover.
However, if the driver has a natural roll off of 1st order type, then adding a 1st order xover will create a 2nd order roll off.
The 1st order electrical of the crossover will add to the 1st order of the driver you create a 2nd order acoutic roll off. Again what you hear will be 2nd order even though the crossover is 1st order.
The electric plus the driver = acoustics response.
As regards to the drivers, the MDT 32 tweeter is very nice and is highly regarded around these parts. I tried to find some information on the MW244 and came up with some but not enough.
Hope thats helpful Matt
thanks
thanks, for help, You are very friendly diyaaudio guy 🙂
its morel mw 224. I found only some specifications, sens is 92db/w/m, an that is all. I even write to morel but they dont have inf, because it was made in 89y.
the bigest head pain if I will try do RC 🙂 so I now listen it in folowing. morel mtd 5.6uf 630V audyn cap, morel mw 224 turn to spule, home made, at listening tests. here is a litle midrange on I think.. 🙁
morel mtd 32 is not so good as I hope- it has very good power dynamic features, but also has some plastic sound in around 1200-2000hz, cheap audax textile driver has not this minus, but colours sound a lot, so I choose morel. in future I am planing to change it to mtd 33, or some nice focal tweeter, with is increribly smooth. I cant even believe that I am listen to metal dome..
thanks, for help, You are very friendly diyaaudio guy 🙂
its morel mw 224. I found only some specifications, sens is 92db/w/m, an that is all. I even write to morel but they dont have inf, because it was made in 89y.
the bigest head pain if I will try do RC 🙂 so I now listen it in folowing. morel mtd 5.6uf 630V audyn cap, morel mw 224 turn to spule, home made, at listening tests. here is a litle midrange on I think.. 🙁
morel mtd 32 is not so good as I hope- it has very good power dynamic features, but also has some plastic sound in around 1200-2000hz, cheap audax textile driver has not this minus, but colours sound a lot, so I choose morel. in future I am planing to change it to mtd 33, or some nice focal tweeter, with is increribly smooth. I cant even believe that I am listen to metal dome..
Heh just because it is a metal dome doesnt mean to say its not that good.
Regarding the MDT I have used this and it sounds great, but then again personal taste has a lot to do with audio, so what pleases someone will be hated by someone else. Either way it sounds as if the only way to get anything on the 244 is to get some measurements youself.
This isnt as hard as it seems, if you build the wallin jig and get loudspeaker worshop, you can do all this on your own.
A jig shouldnt cost you much to build. less then 20 euros, and loudspeaker workshop is free! Just search for both and you should find them pretty quickly.
Having measured both drivers (no point in measuring just the bass) you could embark on using LSworkshop to design your own crossovers, also if you send me driver information I could have a go at designing a crossover for you. Im no pro when it comes to loudspeakers im still learning a lot myself, but I'd be glad to help.
Matt
Regarding the MDT I have used this and it sounds great, but then again personal taste has a lot to do with audio, so what pleases someone will be hated by someone else. Either way it sounds as if the only way to get anything on the 244 is to get some measurements youself.
This isnt as hard as it seems, if you build the wallin jig and get loudspeaker worshop, you can do all this on your own.
A jig shouldnt cost you much to build. less then 20 euros, and loudspeaker workshop is free! Just search for both and you should find them pretty quickly.
Having measured both drivers (no point in measuring just the bass) you could embark on using LSworkshop to design your own crossovers, also if you send me driver information I could have a go at designing a crossover for you. Im no pro when it comes to loudspeakers im still learning a lot myself, but I'd be glad to help.
Matt
this is what I could find, I dont know if everything is correct..... for instance Sd is not sure
Morel:MW-224
Fs 32,00 Hz
Re 8,00 Ohm
Qms 10,00
Qes 0,55
Sd 410,4 cm2
Vas 58,6 l
Xmax peak 5,00 mm
Le 1,82 mH
Le2 0,00 mH
Re2 0,00 Ohm
Nominal Power 120,0 W
the above leads to:
SPL at 1 W 1 m 87,1 dB
SPL at 2.83 Vrms 1m 86,8 dB
Max SPL at 120 W 107,9 dB
Qts 0,520
Effective Qts 0,551
Mms 99,89 g
Cms 0,248 mm/N
Rms 2,008 kg/s
Bl 17,11 Tm
Ref. efficiency, n0 0,337 %
Efficiency, n 0,317 %
Applied voltage 30,98 Vrms
good luck!
Morel:MW-224
Fs 32,00 Hz
Re 8,00 Ohm
Qms 10,00
Qes 0,55
Sd 410,4 cm2
Vas 58,6 l
Xmax peak 5,00 mm
Le 1,82 mH
Le2 0,00 mH
Re2 0,00 Ohm
Nominal Power 120,0 W
the above leads to:
SPL at 1 W 1 m 87,1 dB
SPL at 2.83 Vrms 1m 86,8 dB
Max SPL at 120 W 107,9 dB
Qts 0,520
Effective Qts 0,551
Mms 99,89 g
Cms 0,248 mm/N
Rms 2,008 kg/s
Bl 17,11 Tm
Ref. efficiency, n0 0,337 %
Efficiency, n 0,317 %
Applied voltage 30,98 Vrms
good luck!
dokter dB said:
what? 🙂
its a 6ohm driver(voice coil shows- 4.4ohm) sensitivity,I find is 92db/w/m. moving mass is around 21-23g. and its 22.4mm driver. hard to imagine 410cm2..
anyway very thanks for help
hope some datas is corect. if anyone has datas about this driver I will be glad to receive any inf. label says morel mw 224,4ohm,120wpower,double magnet,xehatech voice coil 3' year of made is 88-89.
Hmmm mixed bag, everywhere I look I get the sens at 92.
The QTS is also noted at 0.52.
I have also found that the driver is 8 ohm.....
Not that is really matters.
With the figures that dokter provides you get a nice bass response out of the driver.
With a volume (rather large) or 70 litres 100% fill you get an f3 of about 48 hz, which rolls off at 12db per octave. This is a sealed box of Q 0.7
Ported volume of 80 litres with a port tuning at 25 hz you get an f3 of 25hz.. I fudged the figures a little to get better results.
With a BB4 alignment that gave the smallest boxes (all others HUGE) there is a big peak before roll off with this driver.
However I feel that the parameters are a little optamistic, a SD of 410 with an 8-9" driver seems too large, most other 8" are about 230 cm. Other 8" have a QMS of about 3-4. The other Morel at 8" seem to be about 0.2-0.35 QMS.
Matt
The QTS is also noted at 0.52.
I have also found that the driver is 8 ohm.....
Not that is really matters.
With the figures that dokter provides you get a nice bass response out of the driver.
With a volume (rather large) or 70 litres 100% fill you get an f3 of about 48 hz, which rolls off at 12db per octave. This is a sealed box of Q 0.7
Ported volume of 80 litres with a port tuning at 25 hz you get an f3 of 25hz.. I fudged the figures a little to get better results.
With a BB4 alignment that gave the smallest boxes (all others HUGE) there is a big peak before roll off with this driver.
However I feel that the parameters are a little optamistic, a SD of 410 with an 8-9" driver seems too large, most other 8" are about 230 cm. Other 8" have a QMS of about 3-4. The other Morel at 8" seem to be about 0.2-0.35 QMS.
Matt
I am on nknowing now.. 🙁
I looke to others morel 9'drivers and find that manuf.recomend about 18-28l. closed boxes. I did 30l closed boxes(very massive). the bass semms now disapear, only the lowest bass can be heard, no rool on mid bass, which I hate.
I even cosult with local famous audio magazine director and he advise to do closed(not ported) box at 20-25l. at firs I was planing to do 85l, but he told that driver will start booom in such a large box. I like closed box becuase its litle roll of. for ex. ported box- 50hz -3db. closed 50hz -6db. but when we go for 30hz. ported shows -15db, as close only -8. am I wright?
I spent lot of money for this box, I wish I knew optimal litres for this driver before.
I have dynaudio, also herad morel mw 256, but theese drivers are plastic sounding pieces of crap(it is only my taste, others maybe disagree)
so what should I do? 🙁
I looke to others morel 9'drivers and find that manuf.recomend about 18-28l. closed boxes. I did 30l closed boxes(very massive). the bass semms now disapear, only the lowest bass can be heard, no rool on mid bass, which I hate.
I even cosult with local famous audio magazine director and he advise to do closed(not ported) box at 20-25l. at firs I was planing to do 85l, but he told that driver will start booom in such a large box. I like closed box becuase its litle roll of. for ex. ported box- 50hz -3db. closed 50hz -6db. but when we go for 30hz. ported shows -15db, as close only -8. am I wright?
I spent lot of money for this box, I wish I knew optimal litres for this driver before.
I have dynaudio, also herad morel mw 256, but theese drivers are plastic sounding pieces of crap(it is only my taste, others maybe disagree)
so what should I do? 🙁
Im not sure, the lack of mid bass could be to do with baffle step. You could try compensating for this and see what happens.
Im surprised by your comments of the dyn drivers as they are meant to be one of the best, could it be the crossover isnt perfect for the dyns??
It sounds to me that what you need to do is get the drivers measured for frequency and all of their parameters, then you will truly know what box they require.
Have you tried contacting morel and seeing if they can provide you with details on these drivers?
Other then that I cant really offer any more help.
What crossovers are you using at the moment? Is there any baffle step built in?
Im sorry I cant be of any more help but without any more info on the drivers I can be much more help.
Im surprised by your comments of the dyn drivers as they are meant to be one of the best, could it be the crossover isnt perfect for the dyns??
It sounds to me that what you need to do is get the drivers measured for frequency and all of their parameters, then you will truly know what box they require.
Have you tried contacting morel and seeing if they can provide you with details on these drivers?
Other then that I cant really offer any more help.
What crossovers are you using at the moment? Is there any baffle step built in?
Im sorry I cant be of any more help but without any more info on the drivers I can be much more help.
thanks for reply.
can You suggest aprox.closed box volume. as i understand for some reason closed boxes has small volume then ported.
I will try to find more datas about mw 224. morel manuf. doesnt know anything about it 🙁
regarding dynaudio- this speaker is good in tonal balance in mid bass-mids, also are very trasparent, and detail,has pacy bass, but hass some plastic sound, also lack mw 224 softness and warmness. its my personal taste. I was planing to built speakers based on dyns(in my country this model goes for (610usd/pair!), but when heard morel love it at first sight..
one dynaudio I sold, other lays arround useless.
very sad thet there no persons who measure frequesncy responce.
there is not a lot miss of shooting x-over when constructing two way system I think. 3 or 4 way is abig headpain..
I will try to find more datas about mw 224. morel manuf. doesnt know anything about it 🙁
can You suggest aprox.closed box volume. as i understand for some reason closed boxes has small volume then ported.
I will try to find more datas about mw 224. morel manuf. doesnt know anything about it 🙁
regarding dynaudio- this speaker is good in tonal balance in mid bass-mids, also are very trasparent, and detail,has pacy bass, but hass some plastic sound, also lack mw 224 softness and warmness. its my personal taste. I was planing to built speakers based on dyns(in my country this model goes for (610usd/pair!), but when heard morel love it at first sight..
one dynaudio I sold, other lays arround useless.
very sad thet there no persons who measure frequesncy responce.
there is not a lot miss of shooting x-over when constructing two way system I think. 3 or 4 way is abig headpain..
I will try to find more datas about mw 224. morel manuf. doesnt know anything about it 🙁
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=290126
in this topic there is an excel sheet to measure the pars, the only way to be sure right now
its easy to do
make sure there is not too much noise around, because it will influence your measurement.....
good luck!
in this topic there is an excel sheet to measure the pars, the only way to be sure right now
its easy to do
make sure there is not too much noise around, because it will influence your measurement.....
good luck!
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