Agree, looks like either .7 or .9 Qts
Fs not much lower than 40 Hz
250 liters for a enclosure or almost 9 cubic feet ??
More like 90 liters it dont do much below 50 Hz
be bloomy one note hum.
You cant tune much more than 10 Hz below Fs, the magnet has no control.
And rather evident in the sim and impedance curve= nothing down there
pretty much = junk
Subs have 20 to 25 Hz Fs not 40 Hz
.5 Qts is almost as high as you should tolerate for a cheapo sub.
And Fs should be at least 30 ish Hz
With a 15" it is easy to get 20 to 25 Hz even with a cheap sub.
12 to maybe 16mm xmax is realistic for a cheapo.
If higher it is likely a peak to peak fantasy number.
Otherwise Fs is likely very poor to get it to travel.
Or some nonsense above 70% BL
I agree rather nice church, lots of corners.
With corner loading or wedge the box right in a corner, firing straight up.
Exit the ports so they dont face the wall of course.
You get a lot of extra bass reinforcement with corner loading
Fs not much lower than 40 Hz
250 liters for a enclosure or almost 9 cubic feet ??
More like 90 liters it dont do much below 50 Hz
be bloomy one note hum.
You cant tune much more than 10 Hz below Fs, the magnet has no control.
And rather evident in the sim and impedance curve= nothing down there
pretty much = junk
Subs have 20 to 25 Hz Fs not 40 Hz
.5 Qts is almost as high as you should tolerate for a cheapo sub.
And Fs should be at least 30 ish Hz
With a 15" it is easy to get 20 to 25 Hz even with a cheap sub.
12 to maybe 16mm xmax is realistic for a cheapo.
If higher it is likely a peak to peak fantasy number.
Otherwise Fs is likely very poor to get it to travel.
Or some nonsense above 70% BL
I agree rather nice church, lots of corners.
With corner loading or wedge the box right in a corner, firing straight up.
Exit the ports so they dont face the wall of course.
You get a lot of extra bass reinforcement with corner loading
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The lilwrecker is good for 115db at 16Hz and doesn't require a ton of power. I built one for my home theater and it is a beast.
https://www.avsforum.com/threads/lilmikes-lilwrecker.1451519/
https://www.avsforum.com/threads/lilmikes-lilwrecker.1451519/
That looks like a reasonable build. Not too many challenges in the angle dept. and straightforward design.
Working with a venue such as the chapel that is shown is just beyond my comprehension. Measuring... from where? Placement of sub? Same question. I would be spit balling since there are multiple places to sit as a listener, and I can't even imagine what the room modes would look like in such partially partitioned area the size of this. If I could just wave a magic wand, the sub would be in a subterrain position with a vent in the floor.
Working with a venue such as the chapel that is shown is just beyond my comprehension. Measuring... from where? Placement of sub? Same question. I would be spit balling since there are multiple places to sit as a listener, and I can't even imagine what the room modes would look like in such partially partitioned area the size of this. If I could just wave a magic wand, the sub would be in a subterrain position with a vent in the floor.
Thank you all for these tips...very helpful. I think I have pretty much decided upon the lilwrecker - the performance is exactly what I am looking for, with the efficency to boot. I really like that it is a tested design, so (assuming I build it correctly) the perfornamce is a given (how it interacts with the space that is this chapel is another story...).
The only thing I am struggling with now is finding a driver. The drivers given in that thread are very difficult to find, at least here in Europe. I am working on finding something with the same/very close specifications, but I am a little bit worried about substituting something that is not tested, though I know that if the specifications line up then it should work.
The only thing I am struggling with now is finding a driver. The drivers given in that thread are very difficult to find, at least here in Europe. I am working on finding something with the same/very close specifications, but I am a little bit worried about substituting something that is not tested, though I know that if the specifications line up then it should work.
I used the 8ohm Alpine. I believe several of these drivers are no longer available. Mike provided the Hornresp model so you could play with modern options. I built mine back when I had little interest in Hornresp (a decade ago) so I didn't bother but, these days, can help out if you have difficulty. Mike's designs tend to be forgiving.
I don't know what access you have to cheap amps. I use a Crown XLS that I got on eBay and I use a miniDSP for crossover duties. A used iNuke with built in DSP would likely be perfect.
Honestly, I think I spent more getting really good plywood than I did on any other single component.
I don't know what access you have to cheap amps. I use a Crown XLS that I got on eBay and I use a miniDSP for crossover duties. A used iNuke with built in DSP would likely be perfect.
Honestly, I think I spent more getting really good plywood than I did on any other single component.
I found a pair of the Alpine's on ebay for what seems like a reasonable price (I don't really know...), but the seller wants >$100 to ship them to US, and >$200 to ship them to Europe, which would put me at ~850 just for the drivers, a large chunk of which is just shipping.
I haven't looked at amps yet, but thank you for the suggestions. I want to figure out what driver I am getting and then choose the amp(s) for the driver(s). I also will probably make a thread about routing the audio with my setup, because that is another thing I am struggling with (what to send where and how.)
I haven't looked at amps yet, but thank you for the suggestions. I want to figure out what driver I am getting and then choose the amp(s) for the driver(s). I also will probably make a thread about routing the audio with my setup, because that is another thing I am struggling with (what to send where and how.)
In the thread on the Lilwrecker, they make mention of the Housewrecker. After looking, it seems to be a similar design, but with slightly better performance at the cost of size.
thoughts?
thoughts?
I don't think Mike ever released the plans. I think it was a custom build and built into a guy's house (and was built around a Kicker that no longer exists).
Good idea to go through that thread as newer drivers are probably listed
Good idea to go through that thread as newer drivers are probably listed
Hi,
What are the online stores that ship local products to Italy? I'd like to search the products.
I'm curious about understanding speaker market in Italy and what is available locally.
Can you buy from neighbour countries at a low shipment rates and low tax?
Overseas big subwoofer shipment costs are too high.
@ron68 Here's what I know right now:
being in the EU, I can buy from any country also in the EU (not sure how it works with the UK), with (if I understand correctly) shipping rates/taxes no different from buying within Italy.
I can ship things in from pretty much anywhere though usually at some absurdly exorbitant cost, and I also have to pay VAT (normally already baked into the price in EU places (and UK?)).
That's about all I know at the moment. The thing that has been causing me great difficulties is because this is my first year here, I just don't know where to go to get things, even basics such as wood...never mind something like a driver/amp. Finding places by googling isn't (usually) very hard, but even then I'm essentially at the mercy of what google (or whatever search engine) presents me with. I have a couple very willing/eager people helping me, but they aren't of much help either because they haven't really done a ton of DIY stuff (never mind something as in-depth/specific as an organ), so finding/getting even basic things has been painfully slow as I "learn the ropes" of where to get stuff.
being in the EU, I can buy from any country also in the EU (not sure how it works with the UK), with (if I understand correctly) shipping rates/taxes no different from buying within Italy.
I can ship things in from pretty much anywhere though usually at some absurdly exorbitant cost, and I also have to pay VAT (normally already baked into the price in EU places (and UK?)).
That's about all I know at the moment. The thing that has been causing me great difficulties is because this is my first year here, I just don't know where to go to get things, even basics such as wood...never mind something like a driver/amp. Finding places by googling isn't (usually) very hard, but even then I'm essentially at the mercy of what google (or whatever search engine) presents me with. I have a couple very willing/eager people helping me, but they aren't of much help either because they haven't really done a ton of DIY stuff (never mind something as in-depth/specific as an organ), so finding/getting even basic things has been painfully slow as I "learn the ropes" of where to get stuff.
Thank you! So you're knew to Europe/Italy.
According to what you say, it's the same problem I have in my country.
I always rely on local vendors for woofers - not always what I want, but what I can buy at a reasonable cost.
I adapt my projects to the woofers available.
I gues you need to do the same.
Do a research and check the T/S parameters of what you can buy.
Then, you move to the enclosure project to best fit performance and cost.
As I could search, there are italian subwoofer vendors and certainly are others in France, Germany, Spain etc.
According to what you say, it's the same problem I have in my country.
I always rely on local vendors for woofers - not always what I want, but what I can buy at a reasonable cost.
I adapt my projects to the woofers available.
I gues you need to do the same.
Do a research and check the T/S parameters of what you can buy.
Then, you move to the enclosure project to best fit performance and cost.
As I could search, there are italian subwoofer vendors and certainly are others in France, Germany, Spain etc.
Yes I just have to compare specifications and find a similar driver. Was just hoping I would be able to find one of the drivers in that thread, but I guess not...
I may be stating the obvious, but that sort of enclosed space looks likely to get lots of room gain below ~50Hz, so the requirements probably don't have to be so extreme to achieve decent 16Hz output.
4 x 15" woofers in large sealed boxes would rattle the windows, and probably do it at quite low power, afaict. SB Audience drivers come to mind.
Yes, and they have a cool parameter search that includes T/S. So it's easy to filter out.
I did a quick search for example, Fs<30Hz, BL>10, QTS<0.5.
Found the Ciare 15.00SW for EU281.00 - it's interesting.
In a dual-chamber 6th order ported (big) enclosure, it responds from 18Hz to 42Hz (-3dB).
With 400W gives 116dB.
Just ideas...
We designed and built the speakers for the Bradford Computer Organ by Peter Comerford. IIRC, the commercial company was Wyvern Organs. The biggest installation was in Worcester Cathedral with 32 E90-O organ speakers, 32 E90-S subs and 64 x 100W amps. This was retired a few years ago as I believe Wyvern are no longer in business.
For a small church, there were 2 x 90 ltr E90-Os which went down to 32Hz and 2 horn arrays for the HF. All driven by 2 x 100W amps.
To get that last 8ve, from 16 - 32 Hz required another 2 x 90 ltr subs with another 2 x 100W. There was substantial electronic EQ.
What do Hauptwerk supply & recommend?
For a small church, there were 2 x 90 ltr E90-Os which went down to 32Hz and 2 horn arrays for the HF. All driven by 2 x 100W amps.
To get that last 8ve, from 16 - 32 Hz required another 2 x 90 ltr subs with another 2 x 100W. There was substantial electronic EQ.
What do Hauptwerk supply & recommend?
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