Soldering station: induction or not ?

[fireworks]

I'm looking to get a new affordable (meaning Chinese) soldering station.
There are some called "induction soldering stations" like this one:

https://www.amazon.com/Quick-Induct...2&sr=8-1&keywords=induction+soldering+station

and some others which are not induction stations like this one:

https://www.amazon.com/Quick-3104-S...TF8&qid=1481293688&sr=8-1&keywords=quick+3104

What are the advantages of an induction one ? Is it just that fact the it heats quicker ?
Quick heating is a feature I'm looking for.
But the ones without induction seem to heat quite quickly too. For example in this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dve0M0G7QVc

it heats up to 300C in 23s.
This one heats to 300C in 19s:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXwyHwSEOKE

So, what are the advantages of the induction stations ?

 

[peranders]

Why not buy some known brand like Weller, Ersa, JBC, new or used? JBC heats up in 3-5 seconds BTW.

 

[AndrewT]

I have an ordinary resistive heating element solder station, 40W that cycles on roughly a 50% duty cycle.
I have found that the control circuits emit a lot of emi. Switch off soldering station when taking measurements with DMM, or scope.

Will an induction heater be worse, or better?

 

[peranders]

Andrew, you are talking about older irons. Modern types are better when it comes to EMI.

 

[AndrewT]

Mine is relatively modern, not like much of my stuff that's older than many of our Members.

 

[peranders]

Then it's triac controlled I suppose.

 

[suzyj]

I've used Metcal MX-500s and MX-5000s both professionally for about 15 years and for home use for the last year or so. They work by feeding 13.5MHz into the handpiece. The tip has a choke wound on a magnet. When cold, its lossy at 13.5MHz, so heats up. When the magnet hits its curie point the inductance changes and the choke becomes less lossy, so it stops heating up.

That results in really good temperature regulation, so you can use little tips without hassle.

They're a bloody good iron, well worth the dough. I've used them for soldering everything from 0201 chip caps and mongrel qfn packages up to big 4ga terminals.

 

[fireworks]

Thanks for all the replies.
Unfortunately I cannot justify buying a JBC, Metcal, Ersa, etc. since I only do this as a hobby, maybe a few times a year.
So it needs to be Chinese.

Has anyone used a Chinese soldering station, especially a fast heating one ?
If so, how did you like it ?

 

[jean-paul]

It does not. Check Ebay and the like. I recently lost a deal on a brand new Oki/Metcal dual station that was sold for 120 Euro. New in box. Got a 130W Weller dual station instead. Very quick heating and built for a lifetime. I get the impression those HF emitting thingies are more prone to defects than standard resistive elements but I might be wrong.

"Affordable" and "chinese" are not a good combination. I have a defective one here that stopped working after less than a year. Trying to repair it though for the owner that also liked "affordable" and "chinese'....

In dutch we have a saying that translates as: "a good tool is half the work"....

 

[indianajo]

Get a Weller WP35 Weller Professional WP-Series Soldering Iron 35 Watts | WP35 | Weller
A 8" aluminum pie pan discardable to hold it, and a sponge from the grocery store. No switching noise to pop into your records as they play.
The wider the chisel tip the faster you go of course. Occasionally sold with pointy tip which is rather useless, but the latest one came with 1/8" wide tip. 3/16" in tip is better on power devices.
Made in Mexico that hasn't grabbed any resources from anybody lately.
They go on sale occasionally for about $39, but not just before Christmas.
Clean tip back with wire brush occasionally (every 30 hours?), and install solder to make heat flow faster. Also clean electrical pins occasionally with a pick (unplugged)(once a year?). Mine is four years old. Before that for 10 years I had a WP25 that I picked up laying by the ATM and cleaned the electrical pins with the pick. WP25 is suitable for DIP IC's and TO92, not power devices.
Before that I had radio s**** ****ese **** irons which would stop heating the tip about the third time I used them. PIeces of ****.
For vacuum tube work the WP35 will do a couple of wires, but for >5 wires on a ground pin I use a 130 W pistol iron from Sears. I see Weller is selling one of those now for about $40. The big wattage is also useful for 10 ga wire onto a 1/4 phone speaker plug.
Thanks for the recommendation of the METcal MX-500 if I decide to speed things up sometime. I haven't cooked any parts but it takes a while usually.

 

[rif]

Hakko has a good reputation. I own one of their now discontinued models.

 

[seanp2k]

I second the Metcal suggestion. You can find them on eBay for under $200. Since the heating element is in the tip, a new tip is basically a new iron. I got a screaming deal on an mx-5000 station with both regular and ultrafine handpieces, 6 brand new cartridges + 2 complete stations, all in perfect condition with original packaging for $400 shipped. New, such a set-up is about $1k. I almost got this new MFR-1160 for $180 shipped but I really wanted the ultrafine for small SMD work: Metcal MFR-1160 Single Output Soldering, Rework System with Metcal SSC Cartridge | eBay

Metcal will last you a lifetime and be the last station you'll buy, plus again since the heating element is in the tip, new tip = new iron. Replacement parts are widely available and if you ever need to, you can sell it for what you bought it for if you get into one used. I seriously solder way more now because it heats up so quickly and is a joy to use. The short distance between the grip and the business end also helps a lot with precision and accuracy. My last iron was a $15 adjustable station from Parts Express and I'm very glad I upgraded.

 

[forr]

Hakko has a good reputation. I own one of their now discontinued models.

Beware of Hakko fakes.

 

[Dave Zan]

...of an induction one ? Is it just that fact the it heats quicker...

No one seems to have answered your actual question, so here's my attempt.
The benefit of induction is that it can directly heat the tip itself whereas most cheaper units have a resistance coil that the tip slides into.
The more direct thermal path of an induction unit means not only that it can heat faster but the temperature control can be better, less delay in the feedback loop.
That probably matters more if you want to solder a sequence of connections quickly.
Be aware that there are two types of "induction" irons.
The Metcal/Oki and similar from Hakko and Thermaltronics use the Curie point of the heater tip to automatically control the power.
So temperature is not adjustable but is foolproof.
The unit you linked is not like a Metcal, it is adjustable, it uses a thermosensor in contact with the tip.
So it's adjustable but maybe just a little bit extra thermal delay.
Atten, Xytronic and Kingsom apparently use the same method.
The one issue I would check is replacement tips, what choices of size, shape and future availability.
Is the thermosensor part of the tip?
Can it use the tips from other brands?

Personally I have a thermosensor controlled resistive heated iron.
A bit slow to heat up but perfectly adequate for hobby use.
I will replace it with an adjustable induction iron if it ever fails.

Best wishes
David

Just for completeness.
The JBC seem to be unique method.
Resistively heated but the heater is in the tip itself and is used as the temperature sensor too.
Has some of the best of both worlds.

 

[suzyj]

Second Jean-Paul. My home Metcal was bought well-used on eBay. It's not that new and the handpiece had some scars, but after swapping the voltage from 115 to 230 it's worked perfectly, and was (relatively) cheap. Even if you buy a dead one they're relatively straightforward to fix - schematics etc are on the web.

 

[BlacK_Chicken]

+1 for JBC, once you get used to them you'll never look back! The smaller units are not cheap but similar to weller, Ersa & the others. The bigger, more prof., units are very expensive tough.

 

[JohnW]

I've used Metcal MX-500s and MX-5000s both professionally for about 15 years and for home use for the last year or so. They work by feeding 13.5MHz into the handpiece. The tip has a choke wound on a magnet. When cold, its lossy at 13.5MHz, so heats up. When the magnet hits its curie point the inductance changes and the choke becomes less lossy, so it stops heating up.

That results in really good temperature regulation, so you can use little tips without hassle.

They're a bloody good iron, well worth the dough. I've used them for soldering everything from 0201 chip caps and mongrel qfn packages up to big 4ga terminals.

The Metcal / Thermaltronics / OKI are the VERY best soldering irons / systems I've ever used - Wellers and everything else is just Mickey Mouse!

They are not that expensive when compared to JBC / Ersa - yet in a completely different class.

I have a new engineer working for me who came from the space industry (Juno project) where they used some crazy expensive Ersa systems - he's just in love with the Metcal stations we have in the lab and just keeps repeating how the Ersa is over priced "Cxxp" by comparison.

 

[peranders]

+1 for JBC, once you get used to them you'll never look back!...

True but not the first choice for an amateur. JBC is the best soldering iron I have over tested.

 

[fireworks]

No one seems to have answered your actual question, so here's my attempt.
The benefit of induction is that it can directly heat the tip itself whereas most cheaper units have a resistance coil that the tip slides into.
The more direct thermal path of an induction unit means not only that it can heat faster but the temperature control can be better, less delay in the feedback loop.
That probably matters more if you want to solder a sequence of connections quickly.
Be aware that there are two types of "induction" irons.
The Metcal/Oki and similar from Hakko and Thermaltronics use the Curie point of the heater tip to automatically control the power.
So temperature is not adjustable but is foolproof.
The unit you linked is not like a Metcal, it is adjustable, it uses a thermosensor in contact with the tip.
So it's adjustable but maybe just a little bit extra thermal delay.
Atten, Xytronic and Kingsom apparently use the same method.
The one issue I would check is replacement tips, what choices of size, shape and future availability.
Is the thermosensor part of the tip?
Can it use the tips from other brands?

Personally I have a thermosensor controlled resistive heated iron.
A bit slow to heat up but perfectly adequate for hobby use.
I will replace it with an adjustable induction iron if it ever fails.

Best wishes
David

Just for completeness.
The JBC seem to be unique method.
Resistively heated but the heater is in the tip itself and is used as the temperature sensor too.
Has some of the best of both worlds.

To Dave,
Thanks for the detailed answer.

To everybody:
Outside of how quick they reach the soldering temperature (300C-350C), what else differentiates good soldering stations from "less good" ones ?

I'm especially interested in the ease of soldering and its quality.
For professionals, durability of the tips is also important and this is where the Chinese stations fall short.
For me, it isn't since I'm doing less soldering in a year that a professional might do in a few days.

Are the tips of professional stations made of special alloys that facilitate soldering ?

In this case, maybe I should look at Chinese stations that can be used with tips from well reputed manufacturers.

 

[AndrewT]

As far as I know they are all made of copper for good heat transfer.
But the copper must be protected from erosion. Copper is soluble in hot solder.
That means all copper tips and other shapes must be plated.
The common plating used by most is iron.
And it is difficult to recoat with solder if you let it run too hot for too long without any solder.