Just some words about loading. The 2380a has about 24cm length while the TH4001 about 40cm. A huge difference with respect to loading. The 2380a is a diffraction horn having only a very short exponential section. So the loading becomes even worse with the fast opening side walls. It seems that loading does not play an important role here and 400Hz x-over with 2380a is not my cup of tea. These fin horns have an hyperbolic profile from throat to mouth with T=0.6-0.7. So, the loading will be perfect with these and even a passive crossover will be possible as the driver will not show much decrease down to about 300-350Hz. Just decide yourself. You can push your driver with DSP for lower frequencies with your current horn until it moans 🙄
Measurements showed a large increase in THD below 700Hz and a pretty significant drop in measured output. Distortion was audibly worse and the low midrange was anemic sounding. Driver related I would suspect, but diaphragms were NOS, (or so I was told). I concluded I didn't want to invest in yet another set of diaphragms or the cost and complexity of getting them remagnetized -with the potential that the problem was with the design itself.
Point well taken on vertical directivity vs CTC - I believe any of these horns will be similar in this regard to the 2380A, but not better.
I am not 100% sure but I believe the 2380A is loosing control in the vertical plane at around 1kHz, I believe these horns do a bit better in that regard.
I am wondering about excessive diaphragm excursion at very low frequencies if the horn is not loading properly - could this be a problem in your application? Higher distortion, possibly damage the diaphragm?
I have Yuichi A-290 plans and built a pair of them 20+ years ago. They are an exceptional radial horn. I sold them a while ago and they are kicking around the midwest somewhere. Here's a picture of one of them as I was packing them for shipping.
I've also worked up an and Apaxial design for TAD 4001 drivers, much like the smaller throat H-4003 horn. Haven't built them yet, but that one is approaching the top of the cue. That is for a near clone of Exclusive 2401 monitors with 2 15" and using TAD TN-1 networks ...
Either one is expensive to purchase because they are material and labor intensive.
eso
I've also worked up an and Apaxial design for TAD 4001 drivers, much like the smaller throat H-4003 horn. Haven't built them yet, but that one is approaching the top of the cue. That is for a near clone of Exclusive 2401 monitors with 2 15" and using TAD TN-1 networks ...
Either one is expensive to purchase because they are material and labor intensive.
eso
Attachments
Id think a 3d printer would made short of a horn like this....the main challenge of 3d printing is in finishing the surface to remove the rough texture...wood filament is easy to sand, At least in my mind it is...a cnc router would make short work of this horn as well...
Im pricing them both currently
Im pricing them both currently
These were done on a CNC as 2 pieces (plus fins):
They might be convinced to make more.
dave
Today's activity was to determine how well the Radians play down to 500Hz, reconfigured the crossovers and did a 13 pt room measurement in Dirac3. See both corrected and uncorrected results for both channels.
Apparently not getting much tweeter above 14kHz or so at the listening position, I think vertical directivity is playing a major role here as I have done better than 16kHz in previous measurements, but I am refining my measurement technique and there are occasional changes as a result. My highest measurements this time around were a few inches lower than the last time. What I am trying to say is this is a measurement artifact. EQ is not applied above the remarked frequency.
It works well, the Radian has no problem at all reproducing down to 500Hz on this horn.
Overall it sounds a bit more coherent. I am happy enough with the result to live with it for a few days before further tweaking.
Hmm, tweeters. Note that unfortunately I cannot hear much beyond 10kHz on a good day.
The target curve is modified Harman Kardon target. I've added back most of the bass below 100Hz as it adds weight at my modest listening levels and isn't overwhelming even at high levels. I added a dip centered just above 1kHz, it's fairly mild, and the rest of it is basically the HK curve offset a bit to align with the dip.
See the attached measurements below from Dirac3. I've added a room simulation from REW. The room is rather more complicated than shown, but given the tool I did the best I could.
Apparently not getting much tweeter above 14kHz or so at the listening position, I think vertical directivity is playing a major role here as I have done better than 16kHz in previous measurements, but I am refining my measurement technique and there are occasional changes as a result. My highest measurements this time around were a few inches lower than the last time. What I am trying to say is this is a measurement artifact. EQ is not applied above the remarked frequency.
It works well, the Radian has no problem at all reproducing down to 500Hz on this horn.
Overall it sounds a bit more coherent. I am happy enough with the result to live with it for a few days before further tweaking.
Hmm, tweeters. Note that unfortunately I cannot hear much beyond 10kHz on a good day.
The target curve is modified Harman Kardon target. I've added back most of the bass below 100Hz as it adds weight at my modest listening levels and isn't overwhelming even at high levels. I added a dip centered just above 1kHz, it's fairly mild, and the rest of it is basically the HK curve offset a bit to align with the dip.
See the attached measurements below from Dirac3. I've added a room simulation from REW. The room is rather more complicated than shown, but given the tool I did the best I could.
Attachments
The clearest one is perhaps this: How it works - Dirac
Basically it is DSP based room response correction technology. I was an early adopter of the MiniDSP SHD which is quite transparent and silent connected to my high efficiency horn system. (This is another one of those moments where I went out on a limb, and it turned out even better than I had hoped for.)
SHD - Audiophile Digital Audio Processor
This replaced a pair of BSS Varicurve FCS-926 which are digitally controlled analog parametric equalizers with room response measurement and compensation capability. The SHD was a pretty big step up in sound quality from the 926 which was the best sounding analog equalizer I've found. I still own one which is out on loan to a friend since I don't have space for it.
FCS-926 | BSS Networked Audio Systems
Wow. The driver drops into a well in the horn structure? If so, does the bottom of the well support the driver's weight?
Ooh La La !
Can you spill more details regarding these cabinets? I'd be happy to donate/contribute if this design would suit my 15 inch Faital 15pr400. This render looks stunning!
OT: I currently use the 6-24 crossover to cross between my jbl2450 (with yuichi 290) and the woofers. Currently set to 24/12db @ 480 hz.
See below link with details and measurements wrt this setup:
TAD TSM2 en construction ...des idees !! - Page 5
I am not familiar with the fine detail, my work on the project was the bass enclosure for the TAD1601.
This specific design is the only one so far where the client has donated an amount sufficient for him to get ownership of the design, They are building them to demo their DD TT, i really hope they get to the point of making them for others.
I would love to have the opportunity to do a similar box for a different (more affordable) woofer. This is the biggest (finished) miniOnken to date. But the miniOnken alignemnt tends to smaller boxes than often used, with very articualte bass, but no attempt is made to try to stretch the bass extention for the sake of bass extention. Quality over quantity.
The Yuchi (or whatever your preference is, and it doesn’t have to be a horn) fits in the space between the 2 bass enclosures.
A very important piece for advancing multi amping. My preferred (affordable) active XO.
dave
first look suggests a 100 litre enclosure (the TAD one is 135 litre), and extention to the mid-30s F10 anechoic.
dave
Wow, this thread really moves. I run it full out to 20 kHz with gobs of EQ. The polars are excellent all the way to 16 kHz. The 2445 has a titanium diaphragm that is a resonance palooza above 10 kHz but in practice with auto FIR eq, I don’t hear it all. It sounds smooth and extended.