Lower distortion due to the copper in the pole piece and the stiffer aluminum cone, also the phase plug which draws heat from the motor further reducing distortion. They will also go lower.
Of course truth be told, I would recommend the 8" Daytons if I knew you would want to use them up to that frequency you stated, but even then you might get a poor polar response...never mind using a 12"
Of course truth be told, I would recommend the 8" Daytons if I knew you would want to use them up to that frequency you stated, but even then you might get a poor polar response...never mind using a 12"
There is no way those drivers could or should get up to 1500Hz.
So, I believe the specs in the review over those.
I would take a screen shot for you but then I'd have to peel my lazy butt off the couch and go to the computer.
hi,
I have said earlier that I dont listen much past 100 db, and my normal listening is around 70db. no need for high spl at all.
Okay sorry my bad some how I had missed that part a I only got the 300hz crossover point and 93 db efficiency and the wanting to use a P.A. driver.
I have been going over this a lot myself on my latest project and getting to 23Hz at 100 db takes at least a minimum of a 8" driver with an Xmax of 11mm to 12mm.
As my latest project design goal is a peak of 110db with no less than 105db at about 25Hz.
This will get me 100db flat to 20hz with a little room to spare.
It takes two of my High Excursion 8" subs to do this with an Xmax of 10mm.
And I have no desire to run them much more above 300hz to 500hz for my little ESL panel.
One sub 8" sub at 11mm excursion gets me 105.7 db at 25.57hz in a ported 4 cubic foot box tuned to 27.61Hz with 72watts.
I can do better with two of them in a smaller sealed enclosure with a little eq'ing.
Pretty much the absolute limit for one 8" sub, and, yes it does go up to 1200Hz just fine as I have measured it.
It is an old Optimus PRO-CSW800 as I have 6 good ones left.
I have been research the MCM high excursion 8" driver as well and I have finally found some true published measurement figures as well and it seem to be a decent driver although I have not got one yet to try out.
The parameters are not far off of the catalog data and is a great performer.
It is a knock off look a like version of a Tangband W8-740 or W8-740c or so it has been stated.
And it will not make it to 1200 Hz I don't think as the Voice coil inductance (Le) is a bit high.
When I select a woofer I try to find one with the highest Xmax that I can as those types don't come along cheap and of decent quality.
It always seems to be an issue of having the correct T/S parameters as well as the correct ones are rarely published.
It is very easy to make these types of measurement providing you have a good signal generator as well as a frequency counter but any computer with a sound card can do this as well without spending more than about $5.
That is why I had suggested the T3 audio T200 driver, for its Xmax and volume displacement from its large diameter size.
But I agree if I had the budget I would also be looking at the Dayton's as well.
I have seen lots of THD data for them and they are top notch for what they cost.
Maybe this calculator can help you out to get a better idea on the displacements for the requirements you desire.
Piston Excursion calculator
I do Appologize for my misunderstanding.
Cheers!!!
jer 🙂
I have been going over this a lot myself on my latest project and getting to 23Hz at 100 db takes at least a minimum of a 8" driver with an Xmax of 11mm to 12mm.
As my latest project design goal is a peak of 110db with no less than 105db at about 25Hz.
This will get me 100db flat to 20hz with a little room to spare.
It takes two of my High Excursion 8" subs to do this with an Xmax of 10mm.
And I have no desire to run them much more above 300hz to 500hz for my little ESL panel.
One sub 8" sub at 11mm excursion gets me 105.7 db at 25.57hz in a ported 4 cubic foot box tuned to 27.61Hz with 72watts.
I can do better with two of them in a smaller sealed enclosure with a little eq'ing.
Pretty much the absolute limit for one 8" sub, and, yes it does go up to 1200Hz just fine as I have measured it.
It is an old Optimus PRO-CSW800 as I have 6 good ones left.
I have been research the MCM high excursion 8" driver as well and I have finally found some true published measurement figures as well and it seem to be a decent driver although I have not got one yet to try out.
The parameters are not far off of the catalog data and is a great performer.
It is a knock off look a like version of a Tangband W8-740 or W8-740c or so it has been stated.
And it will not make it to 1200 Hz I don't think as the Voice coil inductance (Le) is a bit high.
When I select a woofer I try to find one with the highest Xmax that I can as those types don't come along cheap and of decent quality.
It always seems to be an issue of having the correct T/S parameters as well as the correct ones are rarely published.
It is very easy to make these types of measurement providing you have a good signal generator as well as a frequency counter but any computer with a sound card can do this as well without spending more than about $5.
That is why I had suggested the T3 audio T200 driver, for its Xmax and volume displacement from its large diameter size.
But I agree if I had the budget I would also be looking at the Dayton's as well.
I have seen lots of THD data for them and they are top notch for what they cost.
Maybe this calculator can help you out to get a better idea on the displacements for the requirements you desire.
Piston Excursion calculator
I do Appologize for my misunderstanding.
Cheers!!!
jer 🙂
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hi
can you expand on this. what do you mean? A 12 inch is better or worse then a 8inch?
If you try to cross a 12" driver at 1200Hz you are going to have a poor off axis polar response.
Yes, aside from cone break up (resonances) of larger cones at the higher frequency's, Their polar pattern or frequency dispersion pattern gets more narrower for the higher frequency's as the dia meter is in increased.
This is a picture of such a pattern for an 8" woofer.
At 1.2Khz the angle of dispersion is already less as about -5db for +/- 60 degrees off of the center.
The First Blue line.
Its beam width is about +/- 30 degrees or less more about 22.5 degrees for an equal 90db and gets narrower as the frequency goes up.
As at each octave higher this beam width is approximately halved.
jer 🙂
This is a picture of such a pattern for an 8" woofer.
At 1.2Khz the angle of dispersion is already less as about -5db for +/- 60 degrees off of the center.
The First Blue line.
Its beam width is about +/- 30 degrees or less more about 22.5 degrees for an equal 90db and gets narrower as the frequency goes up.
As at each octave higher this beam width is approximately halved.
jer 🙂
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the 1.2k polar response is not that bad. Perhaps you forgot to substract the small red 10 hz response?
No, its not for an 8" but for a 12"woofer the 2.56k purple curve will be more what the 1.2k curve would look like.
No, I didn't miss the 10hz curve as I was using the color code anyhow.
Even though 12" is 33% more than 8" woofer it is actually almost double.
The effective diameter of an 8" woofer is about 6" to 7" were a 12" woofer's effective diameter is about 10" to as much as 11.25" on some drivers.
Thanks.
jer 🙂
No, I didn't miss the 10hz curve as I was using the color code anyhow.
Even though 12" is 33% more than 8" woofer it is actually almost double.
The effective diameter of an 8" woofer is about 6" to 7" were a 12" woofer's effective diameter is about 10" to as much as 11.25" on some drivers.
Thanks.
jer 🙂
not sure about the 1200hz
might be that you instead end up with a woofer that isnt really good at neither bass nor midrange, but only good in the midbass and lower mid 'range'
but whatever, these two could be 'possible candidates'
Faital Pro 12FH520 Speakers - Faital Pro 12FH520 bass guitar speaker and PA speaker that has a lightweight neodymium magnet - Faital Pro 12FH520 1,200 watt 12" has a high efficiency of 98dB SPL. For all high power mid-bass and bass applications. Fait
Faital Pro 12HP1060 12" Speakers - Faital Pro 12HP1060 subwoofer 12" speaker that has a lightweight neodymium magnet - Faital Pro 12HP1060 2,000 watt 12" woofer for all high power bass applications. Faital Pro 12HP1060.
I think that was a solid choice. If you were going to crossover a 12" driver at 1200Hz, as everyone seems to be discussing now, you'd hopefully be using a waveguide/horn with comparable beamwidth, in which case the polar response of the 12" is not "poor", it's rather ideal.
I agree.
cross a 8" at 2khz.
cross a 12" at 1,200hz.
cross a 15" at 800hz.
But yes, the radiation will be 90x90, maybe more.
I cross 15's to 90 x 40 degree horn at 750hz.
cross a 8" at 2khz.
cross a 12" at 1,200hz.
cross a 15" at 800hz.
But yes, the radiation will be 90x90, maybe more.
I cross 15's to 90 x 40 degree horn at 750hz.
Sure, i agree if using a waveguide like the Emerald Physics CS2...or norman's creation. but you are still going to get vertical lobing which will have a colored ceiling or floor bounce or both, depending on the odd or even order crossover.
of course norman's is a bit better because of the horn height.
but norman, is that a 2.5 way or are both 15's crossed at 750.
of course norman's is a bit better because of the horn height.
but norman, is that a 2.5 way or are both 15's crossed at 750.
ive only used it from 40hz to 350hz. I now use a omega pro 15 inch though. Ive never compared the beyma to any other 12 inch, so cannot really say how good is it compared to other 12 inches.
I thought that would just make the poor off axis response equal for both drivers
There is a large body of research which suggests that controlled directivity of a loudspeaker is ideal. A 90x90, 60x60, 90x45, etc. waveguide is one approach. You didn't happen to miss the last 5 years, did you?
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