After finishing some electronics projects I'm now into speakers again. Call me crazy but I've really like to build something big this time. Currently my main system is build around a Limmer 630BC-flare with B&C DE360 and 6NDL38 - supported by a 10" Wavecor for the lows. Really nice whats coming out there - but you all know how life is going and we all are never finished with our projects.
So this time it will be something big and extravagant. I've bought the 3D drawing of the ES-290 by @Joseph Crowe yesterday and they are prepared for 3D printing already. Means: The big chonky horn is divided into eight pieces per half to get them on the bed of my printer. I'm using Fusion 360 for this. I've also prepared the single parts to be put together again using holes and dowels as you can see in the figure below.
It's looking neat and tiny in Fusion... But my printer bed is measuring 220x220 - know do your maths 😵. My CAD workstation got into some sweat during preparation.
Currently I'm doing some evaluation about printer settings, layer height and printing speed for the best quality with the least rework as possible (well the latter will always be a dream in reality - but let me stay dreaming for now). The evaluation models are printing using nearly no and the simplest infill for saving time (10% grid). It's just about how smooth it can get. The first try was using 0,5mm layer height with a 0,8mm nozzle (taking 14h for the bigger part in the picture below).
Not satisfying - so currently I'm doing another print using 0,3mm layers with a 0,6mm nozzle and slower speed - the example above was printed with 120mm/s. I'm at 60mm/s now and it's looking a lot more promising by now - but not as perfect as such an expensive and time consuming project could be in the end.
So I decided to use 0,16mm layers with a 0,6mm nozzle for doing the calculations for "final manufacturing" with a much bigger wall strength (set to 17x0,6mm -> 10,2mm walls) and stronger solid bottom- and top layers (10mm). I also calculated with much more and multidimensional infill - 50% gyroid for the direct exposed parts and equivalent less dense for the outer and rear parts should be enough.
Everything is prepared for using a single 1000g respectively 3000g roll filament per part as it can be seen above (green/yellow highlighted weight). I'll print using PLA filament because it's tought when using the correct settings and good for glueing without trouble. It's good behaving during post-processing (grinding, fill-ups), too. Last but not least it's easy to get in 3000g rolls too. PCTG would have been my favorite but it's not that easy to handle for glueing and there are not that many offers for 3000g rolls. I've been using PETG-CF in the past for adapters and baseplates in other projects but that filiament is not that good for doing smooth things like the inside of the horn.
So this time it will be something big and extravagant. I've bought the 3D drawing of the ES-290 by @Joseph Crowe yesterday and they are prepared for 3D printing already. Means: The big chonky horn is divided into eight pieces per half to get them on the bed of my printer. I'm using Fusion 360 for this. I've also prepared the single parts to be put together again using holes and dowels as you can see in the figure below.
It's looking neat and tiny in Fusion... But my printer bed is measuring 220x220 - know do your maths 😵. My CAD workstation got into some sweat during preparation.
Currently I'm doing some evaluation about printer settings, layer height and printing speed for the best quality with the least rework as possible (well the latter will always be a dream in reality - but let me stay dreaming for now). The evaluation models are printing using nearly no and the simplest infill for saving time (10% grid). It's just about how smooth it can get. The first try was using 0,5mm layer height with a 0,8mm nozzle (taking 14h for the bigger part in the picture below).
Not satisfying - so currently I'm doing another print using 0,3mm layers with a 0,6mm nozzle and slower speed - the example above was printed with 120mm/s. I'm at 60mm/s now and it's looking a lot more promising by now - but not as perfect as such an expensive and time consuming project could be in the end.
So I decided to use 0,16mm layers with a 0,6mm nozzle for doing the calculations for "final manufacturing" with a much bigger wall strength (set to 17x0,6mm -> 10,2mm walls) and stronger solid bottom- and top layers (10mm). I also calculated with much more and multidimensional infill - 50% gyroid for the direct exposed parts and equivalent less dense for the outer and rear parts should be enough.
Everything is prepared for using a single 1000g respectively 3000g roll filament per part as it can be seen above (green/yellow highlighted weight). I'll print using PLA filament because it's tought when using the correct settings and good for glueing without trouble. It's good behaving during post-processing (grinding, fill-ups), too. Last but not least it's easy to get in 3000g rolls too. PCTG would have been my favorite but it's not that easy to handle for glueing and there are not that many offers for 3000g rolls. I've been using PETG-CF in the past for adapters and baseplates in other projects but that filiament is not that good for doing smooth things like the inside of the horn.
The prototype using 0,3mm layers with a 0,6mm nozzle and 60mm/s has been completed. Clearly visible that the fine steps forming the mouth are more refined than before using 0,5mm layers and 120mm/s speed. Currently I'm doing the first outer part (Part 1 on the graphic in post 1) using 0,16mm layers - the final setting for the most refinement.
Looking good so far. Note that this is with 15% gyroid infill as this is an outer part. The inner parts will get 50% infill - much more dense.
The package with 8x1000g spools of filament for the smaller parts of one horn arrived yesterday in the evening. I hope I'll get the correct crossover files from @Joseph Crowe next week. I haven't got the pdf for his DCX-464 crossover after purchase via is shop yet...
The package with 8x1000g spools of filament for the smaller parts of one horn arrived yesterday in the evening. I hope I'll get the correct crossover files from @Joseph Crowe next week. I haven't got the pdf for his DCX-464 crossover after purchase via is shop yet...
Best of luck with assembling and finishing those horns! 👍
I printed the ES-450 and ES-600 on a Bambulabs X1C in PLA. My settings:
0.4mm nozzle, 0.24mm layer hight.
5% gyroid infill
2 wall loops (should've used 4, but 2 worked kinda). Only 2 wall loops leaves small holes/gaps in the print, which impedes internal coating.
To increase stability of each printed part and reduce the risk of resonances I "filled" the horn with casting resin (not 100% fill, only so much as the gryroid infill and all walls are coated with the resin). Makes the horn quite inert.
The later sanding and filling took ages though, and the horns are still miles away from the beauty of Crowe's CNC machined wood products. But cheaper, eh?
I printed the ES-450 and ES-600 on a Bambulabs X1C in PLA. My settings:
0.4mm nozzle, 0.24mm layer hight.
5% gyroid infill
2 wall loops (should've used 4, but 2 worked kinda). Only 2 wall loops leaves small holes/gaps in the print, which impedes internal coating.
To increase stability of each printed part and reduce the risk of resonances I "filled" the horn with casting resin (not 100% fill, only so much as the gryroid infill and all walls are coated with the resin). Makes the horn quite inert.
The later sanding and filling took ages though, and the horns are still miles away from the beauty of Crowe's CNC machined wood products. But cheaper, eh?
Thank you for sharing your experience! I think 0,4mm nozzles wouldn't be in advantage regarding quality here because the mouth is formed using the layer height. A smaller nozzle would only mean more printing time for the same wall strength compared with a 0,6mm nozzle.
I don't think it would be much cheaper in the end if you're calculating with energy costs and working time during preparation and post-processing. But I really like doing this things, switching off reality for some hours. Also I'm not the best woodworker of all times and with 3D printers I could enjoy this hobby nevertheless.
I don't think it would be much cheaper in the end if you're calculating with energy costs and working time during preparation and post-processing. But I really like doing this things, switching off reality for some hours. Also I'm not the best woodworker of all times and with 3D printers I could enjoy this hobby nevertheless.
For filling, Revel Plasto is amazing, but expensive. So I normally use acrylic wood putty. There is a trick to make the surface nice and smooth - coat the surface with photoresin and harden it with an UV lamp. Then acrylic spray of your choice. Here are a few pictures of my 3D printed horn prototypes.
Attachments
I used "CRAFT Resin 1:1", which is ment to be used for casting. Laminating Resin would normally be harder, not a 1:1 mix (in volume) and could get too hot for the PLA when hardening. Curing epoxy resin is an exothermal reaction, and I had a PLA print melt away when some laminating resin pooled up on the bottom and got hot during curing.
An equivalent link on Amazon.de would be this (NIUB Epoxy Resin, 4L Resin and Hardener Kit)
Just by the way here's an interesting description on finishing 3d printed horns: https://audiohorn.net/how-to-finish-my-horn/
They recommend spray putty, filler and lots of sanding...
They recommend spray putty, filler and lots of sanding...
I've got a new toy yesterday: A Bambulab P1S. Closed Chamber non bed-shaker. I've done the first part out of it and it is doing the same quality than the M5C in half the time - with the 0,4mm stainless steel stock nozzle still in place. And no Z-wobbling anymore.
@Joseph Crowe also told me he would send the crossover plan for the DCX464 in the ES-290 to me tomorrow. So small but important steps forward.
@Joseph Crowe also told me he would send the crossover plan for the DCX464 in the ES-290 to me tomorrow. So small but important steps forward.
Straight out of the printer after about 18 hours.
Hah, and meanwhile my print is the Yuichi A-290 horn in a downsized version (cutoff apparently at about 450 Hz).
🙂
The Yuichi has these fins (and hard edges), and they might cause diffraction effects, leading to a possibly "more spacious" sound.
Similar size to the Crowe ES-600 horn (in yellow on photo below)
🙂
The Yuichi has these fins (and hard edges), and they might cause diffraction effects, leading to a possibly "more spacious" sound.
Similar size to the Crowe ES-600 horn (in yellow on photo below)
Great job - looking great!
I've prepared the first three parts for glueing today.
I've prepared the first three parts for glueing today.
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Sorry i can't resist
https://www.tronxy3dprinter.com/en-...ter-size-600x600x600mm?variant=44337545347292
https://www.tronxy3dprinter.com/en-...ter-size-600x600x600mm?variant=44337545347292
Top tip: glue upper and lower half seperately, finish (filler, sand, filler, sand, prime, sand, prime, sand, prime) the inside of these horn-halves and AFTER that glue top & bottom together. Sanding on the inside is much easier on half a horn than when it's complete.
Thought I'd try out the big/original version of the Yuichi E-290. Modded the stl file from Joseph Crowe to make it look a bit less massive.
Glued together 9 parts, mounted the FaitalPro HF1460 (Textreme, 3.4"/86mm diaphragm) with the Joseph Crowe Throat Adapter No.2322. Used the Joseph Crowe rear cover No.2021 (printed in TPU95) as well.
Result -> So much more authoritative sound in the lower midrange. Love it! Yes, I'll stick with this horn.
Now just need to print another one and glue, sand, fill, prime and paint it.
Glued together 9 parts, mounted the FaitalPro HF1460 (Textreme, 3.4"/86mm diaphragm) with the Joseph Crowe Throat Adapter No.2322. Used the Joseph Crowe rear cover No.2021 (printed in TPU95) as well.
Result -> So much more authoritative sound in the lower midrange. Love it! Yes, I'll stick with this horn.
Now just need to print another one and glue, sand, fill, prime and paint it.
Realy nice !
Is it the joseph crowe 1786 cabinet with a 15ob350? How this driver perform in a closed cabinet ?