Yeah it's complicated! I don't understand anything your saying other than maybe about the coax. Lmao I have a TCL 55" Roku tv that's about 4 years old now. It has 1 HDMI arc, 3 HDMI, headphone(doesn't work and already replaced the entire main board once because of it), and an optical port. I was using the headphone output but it's very strange because even with the volume at 100 I can't even get 100mv output from it while playing a 500hz or 1khz sine wave from YouTube!
I bought a cheap digital converter box off Amazon awhile ago that has optical in and RCA and 3.5mm out. It works but outputs a very hot signal that I had to attentuate with a 50k stereo pot before my amplifier. If I didn't it made the tiniest movement of my amplifiers volume control go from quiet to full blast. I feel like the few digital conversion boxes I've heard all make the audio sound dull and lacking honestly. Maybe I'm used to hearing some distortion or something in analog audio that I've used my whole life?
I had an older Samsung led tv that only had an optical output on it and I used a LOC for car stereos from the internal TV speakers to create an analog output. I had trouble getting it noise free but eventually got it to work ok but still not great. If I could have made that work I'd do the same to all new TVs from now on.
Our TVs are smart LG TVs, they use WebOS, The are also hooked up to the local LAN. They don't have the Roku OS in them.
So then, our Rokus are the separate units. Stand alone set top boxes ( little black boxes hooked up to the local LAN with ethernet - you could use WiFi too but I have them wired).
Each TV has a Roku set top box mounted on its back and hooked up to the TV on one of its HDMI inputs. We use the Roku remote to control the TV and the Roku set top. For most viewing, our TVs are always switched into the HDMI input for the Roku set top box.
With me so far?
Then we got two Tablo quad tuners - also set top boxes - with large storage (Hard drives). Those are hooked up to an antenna and the local LAN. We can watch live off the air TV stations or record them for later playback.
The Rokus have the Tablo application installed. The Roku remote allows us to load the Tablos and watch Live or Recorded programs. Using the Roku remote.
To watch TV we turn on the Roku set top box and TV, the TV switches to the Roku. With the Roku remote we select one of the Tablos and then select an OTA TV channel or a recording. Or we can also watch any of the other premium channels we got.... OANN, Discovery+... the free Roku channels...
Note: The Tablo set top boxes are always on. That's how they record off the air live programs.
( It gets more complicated, but let's leave it at that. )
So far, we got audio and video... using one remote. We use the speakers in the TV.
If we want to watch Netflix on the TV, it's built in. For that we use the TV's remote. We could use the Roku set top box... but we don't. It would be easier, but I don't watch Netflix, my wife does. So I don't mess with it.
Now if you're with me so far....
In the Home Theater, I also have an audio surround system, plus DVD, a Laptop for movies, etc...
The TV is used as the main source of the audio system in there... my old surround decoder doesn't do eARC, so I took the PCM coax from the TV into one of the surround decoders input. There is no volume control over the PCM signal.
When I use the HT audio system, I control its volume with the surround decoder's remote.
Did that make it simpler?
Of course in reality, my set up is more complicated... but what would you expect from Yours Truly?
By the very early 90s we already had a rack with two Sony VCRs (Super Beta and SVHS), two Sony Laserdiscs, one Sony audio/video switcher, one Sony EP9ES decoder, two video processors, editing controller, audio amplifiers, a 19" Proton TV and a 9 1/2 foot screen with an Infinity Video Reference Projector with 480p line doubler and a five channel PSB speaker set up.
Added a DVD player in '97.
It got so complicated that I made a "cheat sheet" so my wife and kids could use it...
My current system is actually a very hard effort on my side to simplify things.
So then, our Rokus are the separate units. Stand alone set top boxes ( little black boxes hooked up to the local LAN with ethernet - you could use WiFi too but I have them wired).
Each TV has a Roku set top box mounted on its back and hooked up to the TV on one of its HDMI inputs. We use the Roku remote to control the TV and the Roku set top. For most viewing, our TVs are always switched into the HDMI input for the Roku set top box.
With me so far?
Then we got two Tablo quad tuners - also set top boxes - with large storage (Hard drives). Those are hooked up to an antenna and the local LAN. We can watch live off the air TV stations or record them for later playback.
The Rokus have the Tablo application installed. The Roku remote allows us to load the Tablos and watch Live or Recorded programs. Using the Roku remote.
To watch TV we turn on the Roku set top box and TV, the TV switches to the Roku. With the Roku remote we select one of the Tablos and then select an OTA TV channel or a recording. Or we can also watch any of the other premium channels we got.... OANN, Discovery+... the free Roku channels...
Note: The Tablo set top boxes are always on. That's how they record off the air live programs.
( It gets more complicated, but let's leave it at that. )
So far, we got audio and video... using one remote. We use the speakers in the TV.
If we want to watch Netflix on the TV, it's built in. For that we use the TV's remote. We could use the Roku set top box... but we don't. It would be easier, but I don't watch Netflix, my wife does. So I don't mess with it.
Now if you're with me so far....
In the Home Theater, I also have an audio surround system, plus DVD, a Laptop for movies, etc...
The TV is used as the main source of the audio system in there... my old surround decoder doesn't do eARC, so I took the PCM coax from the TV into one of the surround decoders input. There is no volume control over the PCM signal.
When I use the HT audio system, I control its volume with the surround decoder's remote.
Did that make it simpler?
Of course in reality, my set up is more complicated... but what would you expect from Yours Truly?
By the very early 90s we already had a rack with two Sony VCRs (Super Beta and SVHS), two Sony Laserdiscs, one Sony audio/video switcher, one Sony EP9ES decoder, two video processors, editing controller, audio amplifiers, a 19" Proton TV and a 9 1/2 foot screen with an Infinity Video Reference Projector with 480p line doubler and a five channel PSB speaker set up.
Added a DVD player in '97.
It got so complicated that I made a "cheat sheet" so my wife and kids could use it...
My current system is actually a very hard effort on my side to simplify things.
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I'm trying to avoid overcomplicating something that should be and used to be simple. I already hate having all the wires I have with just a 2 channel amp and subwoofer. Lol
Wires?
You sound like my wife.
She drives me nuts. I'll spend hours trying to dress the wires out of the way and she still finds them.
You know, the old reviewer, Enid Lumley at The Absolute Sound always wrote that audio wires should be chaotic. Otherwise you get coupling between them.
Just you wait 'till you go to 8 channels of audio.... you want wires? You'll have WIRES....
Anyhow, I did try to get one of them cheap HDMI-eARC adapters to put between the TV and the audio surround decoder. It just didn't sound that good. So I ended up just going with the optical PCM. That means we don't get the surround from Netflix... I've been thinking of upgrading to a newer surround decoder with HDMI-eARC... we'll see. I just don't want to pay for one of those audio/video controllers ( don't need the video switching ) and I don't want to get a receiver either ( I want real power into my 7 speakers...).
The perfect solution.. .a dedicated, good sounding HDMI-eARC to 8/12 channel decoder with Dolby, DTS, Atmos, etc.. doesn't exist.
IF YOU FIND IT, LET ME KNOW.... I've been looking for one for some years now.
You sound like my wife.
She drives me nuts. I'll spend hours trying to dress the wires out of the way and she still finds them.
You know, the old reviewer, Enid Lumley at The Absolute Sound always wrote that audio wires should be chaotic. Otherwise you get coupling between them.
Just you wait 'till you go to 8 channels of audio.... you want wires? You'll have WIRES....
Anyhow, I did try to get one of them cheap HDMI-eARC adapters to put between the TV and the audio surround decoder. It just didn't sound that good. So I ended up just going with the optical PCM. That means we don't get the surround from Netflix... I've been thinking of upgrading to a newer surround decoder with HDMI-eARC... we'll see. I just don't want to pay for one of those audio/video controllers ( don't need the video switching ) and I don't want to get a receiver either ( I want real power into my 7 speakers...).
The perfect solution.. .a dedicated, good sounding HDMI-eARC to 8/12 channel decoder with Dolby, DTS, Atmos, etc.. doesn't exist.
IF YOU FIND IT, LET ME KNOW.... I've been looking for one for some years now.
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I feel your pain... ...we have TV + 5.2 and a media console that contains all the other hardware mounted "floating" on the wall immediately below the TV. Besides internet and disc / game console sources there is also an OTA antenna in the attic. Zero visible wiring required a LOT of cutting holes in walls, fishing wires, installing new outlets, routing cable along the basement ceiling etc 🙂
Coming back to the original question, with ARC+CEC you get 2 channel audio and TV remote volume control. For 5.1 audio you need eARC (+CEC). With a recent enough TV and 5.1 soundbar it will just work; with older stuff it could devolve into endless fiddling.
For our listening, getting 5.1 to work was/is essential for movie dialog audibility (mostly center channel, I believe). These days it just seems to work, between Netflix etc. running on the TV, and the 5.1 soundbar.
20 years ago I had a very nice Windows PC video hard drive recorder setup, where the software that came with the OTA video decoder & output card could be set up to do automatic commercial detection, marking & stripping. Unfortunately the company (Hauppauge) got bought by Google, and the software support went away (no more adaptation to newer Windows versions). With that setup getting 5.1 to work was tricky (if the TV program had 5.1), and I was always weary of Windows updates that might break it.
For our listening, getting 5.1 to work was/is essential for movie dialog audibility (mostly center channel, I believe). These days it just seems to work, between Netflix etc. running on the TV, and the 5.1 soundbar.
20 years ago I had a very nice Windows PC video hard drive recorder setup, where the software that came with the OTA video decoder & output card could be set up to do automatic commercial detection, marking & stripping. Unfortunately the company (Hauppauge) got bought by Google, and the software support went away (no more adaptation to newer Windows versions). With that setup getting 5.1 to work was tricky (if the TV program had 5.1), and I was always weary of Windows updates that might break it.
(1) Yes, a smart TV with HDMI-eARC and one of the later soundbars you will get the integration. Even if you use an external Roku set up box, it all works very well. But you got to get a sound bar, which, IMHO, just won't do chez moi - I have four surrounds built into the ceiling already... And we have furniture that allows a BIG center channel under the TV and big L/R towers on either side.
(2) Most surround decoders and AV receivers -nowadays- also support HDMI-eARC (+CEC). I'm just sort of cheap on that.
(3) I too had a collection of Hauppauge video cards that built in PVR software... all the way back to '00. It was actually pretty useful and high quality. What I loved was that you could easily replay frame by frame the captured ( recorded video ). But the lawyers got involved, see? I had it running from Windows 95, to XT and even up to Win7. Google and their lawyers suck, huh?
(4) I never tried recording surround in my OTA TV boards though. I did record most of the FIFA World Cup in '02. It was great being able to watch how the line judges were calling non existent offsides and out of bounds against Italy and Spain. Frame by frame! S. Korea stole those two games! I even put up in my own website snaphots that proved the ball was not out of bounds nor the player off side. Awesome.
(5) The Tablos do commercial detection. It's an option. For some reason it doesn't work very well with NHT ( Japanese OTA in Los Angeles ) so we don't use it -a 3rd of the stuff we record is Japanese. Actually, what we ended up doing, since we got two Tablos- is only recording off NHT in one of them.
(2) Most surround decoders and AV receivers -nowadays- also support HDMI-eARC (+CEC). I'm just sort of cheap on that.
(3) I too had a collection of Hauppauge video cards that built in PVR software... all the way back to '00. It was actually pretty useful and high quality. What I loved was that you could easily replay frame by frame the captured ( recorded video ). But the lawyers got involved, see? I had it running from Windows 95, to XT and even up to Win7. Google and their lawyers suck, huh?
(4) I never tried recording surround in my OTA TV boards though. I did record most of the FIFA World Cup in '02. It was great being able to watch how the line judges were calling non existent offsides and out of bounds against Italy and Spain. Frame by frame! S. Korea stole those two games! I even put up in my own website snaphots that proved the ball was not out of bounds nor the player off side. Awesome.
(5) The Tablos do commercial detection. It's an option. For some reason it doesn't work very well with NHT ( Japanese OTA in Los Angeles ) so we don't use it -a 3rd of the stuff we record is Japanese. Actually, what we ended up doing, since we got two Tablos- is only recording off NHT in one of them.
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I've never heard of CEC volume control affecting the stream (it's really not supposed to). Keep in mind that the stream could be 2 channel PCM or compressed audio such as Dolby Digital.
CEC establishes and controls the audio link between the TV and receiver, soundbar, etc.
For those of us that have brought products to market with ARC/CEC, it can be a painful process. Monitor the CEC bus across various TV brands and you'll discover that each manufacturer seems to have their own interpretation of the HDMI CEC spec.
Don't get me started with eARC...
I'm sorry for the rant.
Can't you watch live TV with the Roku box? All my TVs with Roku built in can watch live TV. I don't think you can record it though that's the only difference I see.
I have a cheap sound bar that was bought as a present for a family member and they don't use it. I think I'm going to take it apart and see if I can modify it to give me analog audio out by using the speaker leads. I'll have to buy another LOC first.
I have a cheap sound bar that was bought as a present for a family member and they don't use it. I think I'm going to take it apart and see if I can modify it to give me analog audio out by using the speaker leads. I'll have to buy another LOC first.
Over The Air (OTA) Live TV.
The Tablos are designed to connect to an OTA antenna and a hard drive. You have to pay for a subscription to get the TV Guide.
Then you download -into the Roku- the Tablo application and it appears as another source in the home screen.
The Tablos are designed to connect to an OTA antenna and a hard drive. You have to pay for a subscription to get the TV Guide.
Then you download -into the Roku- the Tablo application and it appears as another source in the home screen.
Oh ok that's something different that ai don't know about. I use Roku live TV as well as others thru peacock for getting live cable channels for free.
Correction: the Software and company was SageTV, not Hauppauge. Apparently there is still an open source version of the SageTV software.
Also slightly off-topic, but potentially worth noting: if you want to do away with a cable subscription, and still watch network TV timeshifted, a phone app might allow better access than a browser app. E.g. NBC does not allow me to stream past SNL episodes from the PC/windows tablet, but I can cast (to a TV) for free from the NBC (not Peacock, oddly) phone app.
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I dumped cable a long time ago, and Direct TV two years ago.... just kept the Internet connection, but I'm looking at going to Starlink before summer. Either way, that'll be around 90-100 per month.
The Tablo TV guide runs about 70 bucks a year. Then I got OANN, Discovery+, Netflix and Tidal HiFi, those combined run about 60 bucks a month. Daughter has Amazon Prime.
I admit I'm furious at the Rose Bowl game being taken to ESPN ( Fuououo79777res ) and NBC grabbing Le Tour De France into a cable channel ( which I will NOT pay to watch ).
For soccer, Univision and Telemundo do all the futbol that I want ( goooooool )...
Other than that, I don't watch much TV, wife does, but she seems to be happy with the current set up. God knows she watches enough hours in the evenings. Which is fine with me because that gives me time to smoke a cigar and have a drink outside. 🚬🍸
Oh, I do watch the Carson reruns... awesome. I record them in a Tablo and then watch them at night.
The Tablo TV guide runs about 70 bucks a year. Then I got OANN, Discovery+, Netflix and Tidal HiFi, those combined run about 60 bucks a month. Daughter has Amazon Prime.
I admit I'm furious at the Rose Bowl game being taken to ESPN ( Fuououo79777res ) and NBC grabbing Le Tour De France into a cable channel ( which I will NOT pay to watch ).
For soccer, Univision and Telemundo do all the futbol that I want ( goooooool )...
Other than that, I don't watch much TV, wife does, but she seems to be happy with the current set up. God knows she watches enough hours in the evenings. Which is fine with me because that gives me time to smoke a cigar and have a drink outside. 🚬🍸
Oh, I do watch the Carson reruns... awesome. I record them in a Tablo and then watch them at night.
I had a good read of the reviews, and no the TV volume info won't be applied to the digital outputs. It will be applied only to the headphone and rca sockets.
I was feeling very frivolous and blew the £8.99 on one. It's a while since I was so wasteful, but it's likely the £30 one I also have in the post, that's the bad buy. I don't want to think about that too much. That other one is also a BT receiver though, and I have powered PC speakers that could use it in the garage. Or there is always eBay, just to sell it quickly. Perhaps.
I don't have a TV, but my PC hdmi sends volume controlled sound to my monitor (that seems to have the sq of an 80s piezo watch sounder) So I might be able to try it on fair hifi.