Which makes it even more practice to focus on dynamic contrast and linear frequency response. A perfect speaker does not hide bad Eqing, out of all the qualities to be considered. A small but resonant peak, too much bass below 200hz, too much, not enough air, intricate Eqing within 1-8khz. Should be clear, as allowed by the room, since the room is detrimental.
Near-field lowers room, so does high directivity, I will combine them both.
It is not a magic concept; it is the sum of all technological measures and layers combined to create 'magical' results.
I tend to describe this concept with "conservation of the source".
It does not necessarily require directivity, although this can be a contributing factor.
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Smaartlive isn’t actually cheap either but if you want what it offers you’ll pay. I was never sure how smaart compared to Diraclive, rew+rephrase, sonar works, etc...I guess Dirac live multi version would be a good direct comparison...I use rew and rephrase. Rephrase to create Fir filtering when I care for it, through IR vst.
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Pano comments
I agree with Pano's premise. And have listen to a couple of systems that lived up to the level of performance he describes. To me, it comes down, more or less to one word, and that is resolution. When the system easily produces tape hiss as exactly that, and oddly it seems to be in the foreground, not in the back ground. Like you are listening from the bottom up. Find a copy of Blossom Dearie recording on Verve of "Surrey with the fringe on top" from the late 50's. Simple un molested recording with a bunch of tape hiss. Find the best system you can and listen to it. If the system is really good, you are transported to the recording session, warts and all. Bottom line, is the best of systems leave the impression you are hearing all there is to hear, be it good, bad or ugly.
I agree with Pano's premise. And have listen to a couple of systems that lived up to the level of performance he describes. To me, it comes down, more or less to one word, and that is resolution. When the system easily produces tape hiss as exactly that, and oddly it seems to be in the foreground, not in the back ground. Like you are listening from the bottom up. Find a copy of Blossom Dearie recording on Verve of "Surrey with the fringe on top" from the late 50's. Simple un molested recording with a bunch of tape hiss. Find the best system you can and listen to it. If the system is really good, you are transported to the recording session, warts and all. Bottom line, is the best of systems leave the impression you are hearing all there is to hear, be it good, bad or ugly.
I find recordings from the 50's amongst the very best, and I think for the reason you suggest, zero processing.
Could you identify those "extraordinary systems" from which you've heard the second effect?
Kurt
I'd say the magic is in the recording(s). It's our job to get it out of there in reproduction. I wouldn't say it's a window to the recording, at least it's not what I shoot for. It's more like 'being a part of it', almost like time traveling, scary even... at least that has been my experience so far. Pure subjective feelings that take over from the often analytical listening mode I'm trying to be in. At least that's how I've experienced it with my system and reason for me to work on it for years on end.
(while trying to find the exact ingredients along the way, if you ask me, balance is a big part of it... not only left/right balance but also frequency balance overall, what fits the room/system. I can't see those separately, the room + speakers make up the system as a whole)
I wouldn't dare state I have it all, but I do recognise the wording Pano uses. I've been swept of my feet many times during my journey.
That makes it worth it to me pursuing this next level and try to make the illusion, because that's what it is, even stronger.
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Hahaha but I have no glass between me and the recording, that's the scary part!
Hearing and feeling is both important to me... even the eyelids can help the listening process (actually the whole body does). I generally close my eyes as to not be distracted by the confounds/boundaries of my room. It still sounds good with eyes open, that's not the problem, but the illusion works better without the distraction of sighted listening. Even though I usually listen with eyes closed, I still want it to sound right/good from the next room etc.
P.S. I do know what you mean, but it doesn't describe the experience that well...
Hearing and feeling is both important to me... even the eyelids can help the listening process (actually the whole body does). I generally close my eyes as to not be distracted by the confounds/boundaries of my room. It still sounds good with eyes open, that's not the problem, but the illusion works better without the distraction of sighted listening. Even though I usually listen with eyes closed, I still want it to sound right/good from the next room etc.
P.S. I do know what you mean, but it doesn't describe the experience that well...
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I was starting to think I was imagining this stuff (that’s what they tell you in the lounge!) I’m glad i’m not alone.
“Being Part of it”. almost as if you are in it right?
“Time travel,scary”......it’s got to be the same, it’s a religious experience that takes over......your In a trance like meditative state. If the dog barks or there’s a sudden noise you snap out of it like ‘where was I ?’
Until you experience it, I can see how people wouldn’t understand it.
I think there's beauty in it if the recording can make you look for things as if it was happening right there... I have a couple of recordings that do just that. I've had family members come home and up close to me without me noticing, a state of trance might describe that (lol). That's what I love about it.
Music is emotion to me, this is the ultimate form/shape... I'm a grown man, 52 years old but I'm not afraid to say I've shed some tears just listening...
I'm not the only one that had this happen listening to my setup... so I think I'm not going completely bonkers
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Music is emotion to me, this is the ultimate form/shape... I'm a grown man, 52 years old but I'm not afraid to say I've shed some tears just listening...
I'm not the only one that had this happen listening to my setup... so I think I'm not going completely bonkers
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That’s cool.....I’ll have really sit down and read that thread of yours, Matt told me I should but now that I know we’re on the same page it might help explain more how I got to this point. Sorry if I got OT
Edit..... I’ve got over 2000 tracks on tidal that I’ve vetted as quality recordings and when my system is dialed I’d say 1/3 give this effect.
Edit..... I’ve got over 2000 tracks on tidal that I’ve vetted as quality recordings and when my system is dialed I’d say 1/3 give this effect.
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are the walls, ceiling and floor near field also? There in lies the beauty of directional loudspeakers. To hear the impact of this take your loudspeakers outside and listen to them near field with no reflective boundaries near by. The effect in essentially what you get with horn.
Mostly big horn systems in relatively large rooms. For example the Jean Hiraga Altec A5 which is were I heard the "separate space" trick the strongest. Also a WE-15A based system, some Quad ESL panels, a certain OB/cardioid system in Portland and even my funny little OB speakers in the lava cave. Mostly that was the room (cave) that made lack luster recordings come alive and excellent recordings a thing of wonder.
As others have mentioned, the room plays a huge part. When both room and speakers are very good and well adapted to each other, extraordinary things start to happen. Things that make me shake my head and wonder "how is that possible with a recording?" Beyond smooth frequency response an excellent sense of space seems to help. I wish I knew how to consistently achieve this, but I don't.
NOTE: Most of these were 3-way systems.