I did try with hornresp to see what happens, however with hornresp I can not see extension of the HF, here I need akabak I think.
regards
Hello kees, i don't have the actual input file for Hornresp, but i found the export for horn cuts and a model of the curved side. Also inserted the measured response. The driver is Visaton FRS8-M
Also some details:
1800cm2 mouth
25cm2 throat
220hz tractrix Fc
46.45cm axial length
Hope it helps..
Also some details:
1800cm2 mouth
25cm2 throat
220hz tractrix Fc
46.45cm axial length
Hope it helps..
Attachments
Thanks
I have found the way hornresp do tractrix but I can not see how far it do go, for hornresp it fall of around 1 khz or so.
I have put in your data and did get the right hornresp length.
But as you see in hornresp HF is not so wel predicted, Did hear dat hornresp is not so well with HF output?
regards
Attachments
Last edited:
Tanks Kees52, yes i should try his speadsheet to understand if this design can be reduced or just has to be new to my goal !
Indeed the relation between front compression chamber, throat size and high end directivity is not clear for me... My understanding is you loose spl with a too narrow throat but you have a better of axis pattern ! I must read more; by the way Tractrix seems good enough for small size, medium efficienty gain and not too bad distorsion behavior... I stayed on the idea these little cone drivers are not suited for phase plug à la compression driver because the lacke of strong motor... Btw asked myself if the notch we saw when trying to extend towards th ehigh end of the 1Of and likes was not more the effect of cone to throat size than a lacke of anything else (phase plug, lenses, etc)
Indeed the relation between front compression chamber, throat size and high end directivity is not clear for me... My understanding is you loose spl with a too narrow throat but you have a better of axis pattern ! I must read more; by the way Tractrix seems good enough for small size, medium efficienty gain and not too bad distorsion behavior... I stayed on the idea these little cone drivers are not suited for phase plug à la compression driver because the lacke of strong motor... Btw asked myself if the notch we saw when trying to extend towards th ehigh end of the 1Of and likes was not more the effect of cone to throat size than a lacke of anything else (phase plug, lenses, etc)
Last edited:
It is not possible to accurately simulate a tractrix horn in AkAbak. A tractrix horn requires an isophase wavefront model. AkAbak uses a plane wavefront model.
Try looking at the on-axis pressure response rather than the power response.
Attachments
Hi David, All well?
Thanks for the advise I go try that. As I have you on attention, export a tractrix width with a conic hight or vica versa can I use conic output or uni, I did see uni did keep the tractrix drawn intakt.
regards
kees
Try it out, made Vtc small because I go use a faseplug in the horn to prevent beaming and get as high HF as possible.
Thanks for the advise your program is like tressure hunting, finding the gold.
Volvotreter has help me making his program have output for akabak so I can copy and past it, and now I see hornresp can also do it, or even akabak is less suitable for it!!.
I hear a constant directivity horn do work also good get wide respons?. But there are not much or no calculators for it.
If I want to export the tractrix with conic sidewalls like on picture, on a 1.6 basis how to do this?. I need to make a new horn because I have play already to much with this one.
regards and thanks for advice.
kees
Thanks for the advise your program is like tressure hunting, finding the gold.
Volvotreter has help me making his program have output for akabak so I can copy and past it, and now I see hornresp can also do it, or even akabak is less suitable for it!!.
I hear a constant directivity horn do work also good get wide respons?. But there are not much or no calculators for it.
If I want to export the tractrix with conic sidewalls like on picture, on a 1.6 basis how to do this?. I need to make a new horn because I have play already to much with this one.
regards and thanks for advice.
kees
Attachments
Last edited:
We can use a faseplug only for less beaming and some extention, for me 3.5 Khz is plenty and so do not need high compression plug.
Ihaver read some papers like the edgar mid horn, where it is shown that bigger throat give more extention in HF, while hornresp give a extentsion when make throat smaller, and so more compression, little confusion here.
A 2:1 horn and a throat equal to speaker sd give that, I did try but hornresp his meaning is different, I think it is what driver is used.
I like the idea of using foam between speaker and horn to damp resonances and remove horn like sound.
regards
kees
Attachments
Hi, i am happy to be on this forum, read interesting stuff and write what i want. But is the full-range category not reserved for one-way constructions, maybe sub/sat combinations, too, but not multi-way constructions. Because the latter have their own category. So is this thread not SPAM. How could the moderation let this happen, 144 pages do not slip thru, and one can react within 17 months. Uli
Grasso789,
Hi glad you happy and of course you can say whatever you want here but please man read hole thread, its all stuff that is considered fullrange (see post 1) when combining a midtweeter and woofer at XO point 500Hz and lower and sometimes called FAST. Okay lately after been on topic most of thread kees52 is beginning talk about add a tweeter or compression driver too but he had not done it yet except share thoughts and planning.
Hi glad you happy and of course you can say whatever you want here but please man read hole thread, its all stuff that is considered fullrange (see post 1) when combining a midtweeter and woofer at XO point 500Hz and lower and sometimes called FAST. Okay lately after been on topic most of thread kees52 is beginning talk about add a tweeter or compression driver too but he had not done it yet except share thoughts and planning.
Hi BYRTT, i do not have the time to read the whole thread. Yes, there is the unfortunate term Fullrange And Subwoofer Transducer. I rather say pressure-coupled multi-way transducer, a multi-way transducer in which distance between centers of drivers is at most 2 * Pi * wavelength at crossover. I would like to see some conceptual correctness being applied. Fullrange means, that it covers the entire range of human hearing, no matter if archieved with one or five ways.
You don't have to read the whole thread but at least look at the first post. There you will see this plot - where is the XO? About 350Hz.
Indeed I wondered if it could be in the Multiway forum but a moderator said that as the Xo was low- this is a FAST and FAST solidly belongs in Fullrange forum.
Indeed I wondered if it could be in the Multiway forum but a moderator said that as the Xo was low- this is a FAST and FAST solidly belongs in Fullrange forum.
it is a single point horn, and so can be seen as a wideband horn, when using different horns it is something else, my goal is first learning because speakers is quite new for me and in my eyes more complicated as amps, playing with rthe surrounding air is tricky.
The system I did want to go make is with a K-tube and bass in that horn, and so making it single point, it is blended in each other and so can me seen as one wideband.
A horn is NOT capable off giving whole wideband we want also, special the low end.
But maybe in my case because I go use a 3 way XO I have to be go to the multiway threat ehhh thread.
regards.
Last edited:
Hi kees52,
If you really want your own thread down the road no problem, but you on topic here a great guy plus help a lot with ideas of speaker stuff mics amps computer setups and also shared greatest sound clips and videos. Member Grasso789 is probably engineer or something but of course he is welcome, we are hobbyist diy'ers and in that we are at diy forum of this domain and not at professional engineer or commercial forum of domain we on track under forum rules. He pop in tell he is happy this thread and this is good stuff but he have not time to read it, instead he has time criticize and tell how he wish policy rules to be for threads in this forum "Full Range", and is that cooperation and special kindly, no that is stuff he shall discuss with owner or staff at domain. Suggest ignore his comment and can say for many months he post in various threads in mostly a harsh and criticizing way always pointing strait to negative stuff about the various builds. Wish he some day would say a kindly or positive word about a members build but have not high hope, here link so you can have a look his own build thread that start up with full speed words "DONE RIGHT" and ended few pages later with nothing other that a war of bickering http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/288140-krassollito-multi-way-loudspeakers-done-right.html.
Last edited:
Happenly we live in a commmunity, so we may give critics, I do even like them, because we can learn from it, however critics about if the thread is right with Xovers or not is not such important, I see a horn mouth where behind is a 2 or 3 way as a single point because of blending.
I do stay here I like it here and share the things, it is not a problem, For clearity I am also a diy man, I do not do commercial things, but has the idea to make hybrids amps and maybe sell them, I think there is a market for it, and we have in our world a lot of rich people who are waithing to get ripped off haha. I am suprised how complicated speakers behave, most has to do with the coupling to the air, so much differences.
excuse my english.
regards