Love dome mids...
Usher 9845 2", used in my Attitudes design.
Morel MDM55 and CAM558, classics!
Dynaudio D76AF, have a pair on hand to use.
Phillips AD0210/SQ4, will be using these in a retro build down the road...
HiVi DMN-A and DMB-A both sound great, but need Fs comp, good to about 850Hz.
Rat Shack 2", I have a quad sitting, we'll see what I do with them...
Satori MD60, not heard this one yet.
Dayton Classic DC50, heard in Paul Carmody's Dayton Classic Revival.
Ciare is on my list to try down the road, as well as maybe the Beymas.
I don't like the Dayton RS domes much.
I have not heard either of the Visaton models, but 3rd party was less than stellar.
I have not heard the Bliessma models.
David Gatti used to have a page with all of the Dynaudio models and specs listed.
Usher 9845 2", used in my Attitudes design.
Morel MDM55 and CAM558, classics!
Dynaudio D76AF, have a pair on hand to use.
Phillips AD0210/SQ4, will be using these in a retro build down the road...
HiVi DMN-A and DMB-A both sound great, but need Fs comp, good to about 850Hz.
Rat Shack 2", I have a quad sitting, we'll see what I do with them...
Satori MD60, not heard this one yet.
Dayton Classic DC50, heard in Paul Carmody's Dayton Classic Revival.
Ciare is on my list to try down the road, as well as maybe the Beymas.
I don't like the Dayton RS domes much.
I have not heard either of the Visaton models, but 3rd party was less than stellar.
I have not heard the Bliessma models.
David Gatti used to have a page with all of the Dynaudio models and specs listed.
re: Phillips AD0210/SQ4 - got a single AD210/SQ8 lying around if anyone in Aus wants it for the cost of postage
Yes, that's true. But 89-90dB/W/m vs. 95dB/W/m is already big gap, though... So in the case of my 375L, the SS D7608 at 92dB would have been at the minimum sensivity limit, I guess...
Yes. Since my sealed project should finally be at circa 92-93dB/w/m, this SS D7608 should be fine for a 4-way configuration, in the Mid-High section. Transition frequencies would be circa WF-LMR=300-400Hz / LMR-HMR=2000-3000Hz / HMR-TW=6000-7000Hz.
The D7608-920010 has a FS at 300Hz. Except if you use a steep slope crossover, I would rather choose at least 600Hz (2xFS) instead of 400Hz... But as always : you have to test to confirm if it can work fine at 400Hz !
I think that a resin flowerpot of circa 2L should be enough, filled with cotton wool inside. That's what I did for my Beyma 8M60N midrange on my 375L :
I choose the biggest of the two, the 7.5L, allowing me a natural frequency cutoff NFC at 110Hz, with a speaker FS at 82Hz, for Xover LF WR-MR at 400Hz (5xFS, 4xNFC).
But it's me, OK ? 😉
T
Thanks to all (& @profiguy for opening that thread) for completing the collection of dome midrange references - available or not... 😎
I really thought that this kind of speaker had fallen in disfavor today, notably replaced with 3" to 5" cone speakers with central ogive trend ! 😕
T
I really thought that this kind of speaker had fallen in disfavor today, notably replaced with 3" to 5" cone speakers with central ogive trend ! 😕
T
I think I've seen that have you got a thread on here about it ? what size enclosure is the w024p-4 ?
Dome mids are in decline and have been…….and it’s been at the fault of the modern recording segment/industry since the late 1990s. NOTHING in my opinion will present a great recording better than a proper design 3 way speaker with a dome midrange…..yet play a poor recording through it and it sounds it……almost unlistenable and loaded with upper midrange honk, smear, plosives, etc. Now take that same poor recording and play it through a well designed two way…..all is well again in the world as overlap region of the drivers mix and mash the mess and pass it through dissecting phase patterns until a lightly salted corned beef hash emerges.
Now take that great recording and play it back through the same well designed 2way……it sounds pretty darn good……and everything in the world appears to be just fine…..until someone plays it through the dome mid three way and reveals just how deep the rabbit hole actually goes.
Fast and Furious…..that’s how the recording/mix and mastering segment has been working for over two decades….full on production environment as the model has changed……there’s simply not enough profit in sales. Mix engineers live their two ways…...puts a nice sheen on dull steaming pile of crap. And the point source single driver monitors too….that lets them know it’ll sound ok on your phone speakers or tabletop bluetooth speaker. On the ride home, in the car everything sounds better…..nothing is on axis to shout out ‘here I am an I’m offensive’……no stereo soundstage to manage either. And forget headphones……it’s an unwritten rule these days not to mix on those because….well…..they wont lie to you ……that steaming pile smells even worse now right under your own nose.
When folks, reviewers, on line weasels doing sighted evaluations go on about the extols of a speaker with this and that bit of music, my toes curl and I cringe to the point of near permanent deformity that they actually think recorded and consumed music is a valid point of reference across different speaker systems without having an actual point of reference for direct in real time comparison (our auditory memory is horrible as a species….it is known)….an excellent recording paired with a well designed 3way equipped with a revealing dome midrange section.
There….I‘ve said my peace……..disagree if you like….or must……..but there’s truth in there for those willing to accept yet another sad reality of the modern era……and just wait till AI mastering is fully in place…. not much longer, it’s already gaining ground along with smart or dynamic plugins used during the mixing process…..it‘s like a game of wack-a-mole in the box these days……
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Wow, I forgot the EM1308! That one sounds really good, and is the same diameter of the lesser RS mid domes. It is worth the swap.
Everytime I hear the classic ATC, NLA, I like it as well.
The TB 2" and 3" are also very good.
The HiVi 3" I have not laid ears on yet, but hope to.
Of note, the Vifa D75MX has gone through several redesigns. There was even a felt-paper version a while back. On the latest, there is a screen grill UNDER the dome for protection. All versions have needed chambers. D7608 is the latest.
Everytime I hear the classic ATC, NLA, I like it as well.
The TB 2" and 3" are also very good.
The HiVi 3" I have not laid ears on yet, but hope to.
Of note, the Vifa D75MX has gone through several redesigns. There was even a felt-paper version a while back. On the latest, there is a screen grill UNDER the dome for protection. All versions have needed chambers. D7608 is the latest.
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I'm in the camp that does not like the RS52AN, and since they moved to another manufacturing company, it has a severe peak/dip right in the middle of its passband.
While the textile version apparently does not measure as well, I found it to be more listenable.
There are similarly priced dome mids out there that sound better than the both of these.
While the textile version apparently does not measure as well, I found it to be more listenable.
There are similarly priced dome mids out there that sound better than the both of these.
In all practicality, the D7608 needs roughly 1 ltr net volume to work properly with a little flow restriction at the rear of it (on top of the felt backing it already has). The extra felt slows down the air flow to get closer to a Qts of under 0.8 (from Qts of over 1.3 in free air) so there's better control of the dome around peak VC excursion for cleaner lower mids. This lowers odd order HD and increases SPL potential around the HP area response.
The other thing which can be done with the D7608 is to increase magnetic flux to the motor by adding another small ferrite magnet on the back. You have to remove the felt backing for this and add the magnet with same pole facing the existing motor, otherwise you end up decreasing flux and further increasing Qts - not good.
Adding another magnet also increases sensitivity a tiny bit, by about half a decibel, which is an extra bonus. The factory FR graph isn't very revealing of the actual FR of a baffle mounted and chambered D7608.
The FR peak you see down low just above Fs is created by the high Qts, lack of back chamber and a secondary peak from the airspace behind the VC gap - this causes the double impedance hump around Fs, which many dome drivers suffer from, dependingon how tight the VC gap is. It ls less pronounced on drivers with extra VC vent holes (which the D7608 lacks) and it usually shows up as elevated HD in the area just above maim Fs. The way to control this is to use an offset (elliptical) HP filter slope. The extra electrical dampening of this filter has the potential of slightly lowering 3rd order HD in the problematic secondary resonance area.
The D7608 is also very sensitive to diffraction caused by not countersink mounting it on the baffle. Its visible on the factory published FR curve at the upper rolloff as a slight ripple. The driver is capable of smoother FR up top when flush mounted. Of course it also depends on how wide the baffle is too. Predictably, surface mounting the D7608 also hurts CSD, but that applies to most other drivers as well.
The other thing which can be done with the D7608 is to increase magnetic flux to the motor by adding another small ferrite magnet on the back. You have to remove the felt backing for this and add the magnet with same pole facing the existing motor, otherwise you end up decreasing flux and further increasing Qts - not good.
Adding another magnet also increases sensitivity a tiny bit, by about half a decibel, which is an extra bonus. The factory FR graph isn't very revealing of the actual FR of a baffle mounted and chambered D7608.
The FR peak you see down low just above Fs is created by the high Qts, lack of back chamber and a secondary peak from the airspace behind the VC gap - this causes the double impedance hump around Fs, which many dome drivers suffer from, dependingon how tight the VC gap is. It ls less pronounced on drivers with extra VC vent holes (which the D7608 lacks) and it usually shows up as elevated HD in the area just above maim Fs. The way to control this is to use an offset (elliptical) HP filter slope. The extra electrical dampening of this filter has the potential of slightly lowering 3rd order HD in the problematic secondary resonance area.
The D7608 is also very sensitive to diffraction caused by not countersink mounting it on the baffle. Its visible on the factory published FR curve at the upper rolloff as a slight ripple. The driver is capable of smoother FR up top when flush mounted. Of course it also depends on how wide the baffle is too. Predictably, surface mounting the D7608 also hurts CSD, but that applies to most other drivers as well.
@wolf_teeth I agree with you regarding the Dayton RS52-AN. The newer version made in China isn't as good as the one made in India. There are alot of manufacturing inconsistencies this driver suffers from. The main one is how much dampening compound is applied. I had 4 of these drivers a while back which didn't match well in Fs, sensitivity and upper mid FR. I got them cheap, so it wasn't a big loss, but it was still disappointing. Since I couldn't use them being so far apart in spec, I cut the dome assemblies out and weighed them, verifying the reason they were so far apart was due to significant variance of Mms. DCR was also pretty far apart.
I had an older set of RS52-ANs from the mid 2000s which sounded much better, but they still sounded too fatiguing in the upper mids, even when the upper breakup peak was filtered out. I tried removing the grilles to see if that improved them, but they still didn't live up to their hype.
In comparison, the Visaton DSM50 sounded much better. I prefer it over most other larger metal domes.
The Bliesma dome mids are also nice drivers. I really like the small mounting flanges for tighter CTC spacing and the higher efficiency of their neo motor. The price is rather high IMO and they're not readily available in the US, unless you're willing to order from Solen, pay import duties and potentially wait a long time.
For the money, the Hivi DMB-A is an absolute steal. It has alot of potential for good sound in smaller 3 ways and larger 4 ways, really only limited by the rather high Fs and Qts.
The Morel MDM55 along with its relatives is a very good sounding mid. It has the best lower mid output capability of any other reasonably priced 2" dome thanks to decent xmax. The small flanges are also a huge bonus, but the dome surface treatment really attracts dust and other foreign particles. The EM1308 version really isn't that much better to my ears. There's a small difference in the lower mids, but the much higher asking price isn't justified and the large mounting flange is a drawback in terms of CTC spacing.
I have yet to try the Ciare and Beyma mid domes. They look pretty good on paper though.
I had an older set of RS52-ANs from the mid 2000s which sounded much better, but they still sounded too fatiguing in the upper mids, even when the upper breakup peak was filtered out. I tried removing the grilles to see if that improved them, but they still didn't live up to their hype.
In comparison, the Visaton DSM50 sounded much better. I prefer it over most other larger metal domes.
The Bliesma dome mids are also nice drivers. I really like the small mounting flanges for tighter CTC spacing and the higher efficiency of their neo motor. The price is rather high IMO and they're not readily available in the US, unless you're willing to order from Solen, pay import duties and potentially wait a long time.
For the money, the Hivi DMB-A is an absolute steal. It has alot of potential for good sound in smaller 3 ways and larger 4 ways, really only limited by the rather high Fs and Qts.
The Morel MDM55 along with its relatives is a very good sounding mid. It has the best lower mid output capability of any other reasonably priced 2" dome thanks to decent xmax. The small flanges are also a huge bonus, but the dome surface treatment really attracts dust and other foreign particles. The EM1308 version really isn't that much better to my ears. There's a small difference in the lower mids, but the much higher asking price isn't justified and the large mounting flange is a drawback in terms of CTC spacing.
I have yet to try the Ciare and Beyma mid domes. They look pretty good on paper though.
I re-purposed a pair of Akai SW125 speaker cabinets with a new baffle. They work out at just under 40Litres and I have them as a closed box with a reasonable amount of stuffing (teddy bear polyester stuffing). I am happy with the sound, nice tight bass and goes plenty low enough for the music I listen to (mainly metal).
There is also the curiosity that is the Morel Tweemid TM4055. Looks like a MDM55 and a CAT308 on the roughly 6”round faceplate. This is one way to solve mid dome / tweeter spacing. Paul Kittinger used it in one of his MLTL speakers with a Scanspeak 18w8531 called the Cornetta and I have just noticed that Speaker Design Works have a new design called the Chevalier using it with the SB23CAC woofer.
@Ugg10. The Morel TM4055 is a combination of the MDM55 mid and CAT448 tweeter.
IMO you'd be better served with buying the MDM55 separately with the CAT308, which is a better sounding tweeter.
If you want perfect time alignment, the CAT378 with the MDM55 is the best choice and I prefer that combo. You could obtain relatively close CTC with most other Morel ferrite motor tweeters.
The CAT448 isn't that great compared to the larger bodied Morel soft domes. It suffers from a pronounced double hump impedance peak, which increases HD and negatively affects CSD in the lower mids.
IMO you'd be better served with buying the MDM55 separately with the CAT308, which is a better sounding tweeter.
If you want perfect time alignment, the CAT378 with the MDM55 is the best choice and I prefer that combo. You could obtain relatively close CTC with most other Morel ferrite motor tweeters.
The CAT448 isn't that great compared to the larger bodied Morel soft domes. It suffers from a pronounced double hump impedance peak, which increases HD and negatively affects CSD in the lower mids.
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I've been using EM1308s for years. Lovely clear, unfatiguing sound.
I have a pair of RS52s in a cupboard somewhere. I never liked them, they impart too much 'character' to the sound.
I have a pair of RS52s in a cupboard somewhere. I never liked them, they impart too much 'character' to the sound.
This one :
https://www.audiophonics.fr/fr/medi...dmba-hautparleur-medium-dome-50mm-p-4768.html
Unfortunately, it seems that those nice and excellent Beyma MC-115 are discontinued...
... And there's no traces of any successor on the Beyma website :
https://www.beyma.com/en/products/
T
Don't forget the Dynaudio D54. It even has been used in Tractrix horns from 600hz up to about 6khz.
One of the best vintage 2"Domes are from Braun. It was the garant for good sound in many Braun and ADS speakers from the mid 70s to early 90s.
One of the best vintage 2"Domes are from Braun. It was the garant for good sound in many Braun and ADS speakers from the mid 70s to early 90s.