Mine was 120 volt AC only - 32 watts per channel. Made out of a cassette deck sawed off a 3-in-one stereo, a couple STK modules, 8” ceiling-type PA speakers and a plywood box. It was built back in college - on a summer work crew in the dorms - around the same time frame. The paint crew was playing reggae music thru a little boom box with 3” speakers - didn’t they realize how dorky that sounds WITH NO BASS??? It’s suppose-a tah have-a BASS, mahn!!!! We just couldn’t stand listening to that down the hall anymore. We gave them Rush and AC/DC with plenty of bass.
I have KiCad 5.1.9+dfsg1 installed. At the moment I am trying to learn inputting/drawing a schematic. Invoking the component selector dialog brings in a never-ending litany of component classes most of which I have never heard anything about. There are thousands upon thousands of components, and this heavy list takes some time to load. What I need is only a list of 100 or 200 components at most, and all this unnecessary browsing for a simple resistor or a simple BJT makes me lose my patience. It also overloads the processor.
Don't tell me this is progress. This is a regression, and I dare say, an expensive regression! Why should an enthusiast need to update their computer hardware to simply draw a PCB? Why should a huge database of component types be necessary for an amateur? And, above all, why should anyone need footprints, whatever they are! An amateur like me does not need footprints, but a tool to draw common component pads directly instead of waiting for an endless database to load. A dozen or two footprints are enough for me.
As if this torture were not enough, there is a never ending nomenclature to learn. This includes abbreviated component class types and package types. Where can an enthusiast learn this weird, unintuitive and alien nomenclature?! Without understanding what the database lists, it is impossible to proceed.
Don't tell me this is progress. This is a regression, and I dare say, an expensive regression! Why should an enthusiast need to update their computer hardware to simply draw a PCB? Why should a huge database of component types be necessary for an amateur? And, above all, why should anyone need footprints, whatever they are! An amateur like me does not need footprints, but a tool to draw common component pads directly instead of waiting for an endless database to load. A dozen or two footprints are enough for me.
As if this torture were not enough, there is a never ending nomenclature to learn. This includes abbreviated component class types and package types. Where can an enthusiast learn this weird, unintuitive and alien nomenclature?! Without understanding what the database lists, it is impossible to proceed.
Last edited:
EasyEDA has a favourites list... That's how I easily find the footprints I use the most.
Every component has a footprint. Why should I have to draw a 9 pin tube socket manually when I can search for "12ax7" and pick one of many that are already there? 😀
If you want to use old hardware, keep using old software or deal with the speed hit.
Every component has a footprint. Why should I have to draw a 9 pin tube socket manually when I can search for "12ax7" and pick one of many that are already there? 😀
If you want to use old hardware, keep using old software or deal with the speed hit.
I had a cool collection of old cameras from 35mm to 4 X 5 inches, and a color capable darkroom with an old Durst commercial enlarger that could eat that 4 X 5 inch negative. I even used the enlarger as a B&W camera to reduce the 4:1 Bishop Graphics tape-up to a 1:1 negative for exposing the board. When my daughter came into the picture the darkroom was converted back into a bedroom and a much smaller darkroom was built in a corner of the garage. Eventually I went digital and sold all of the film stuff.
At least two posters here are apparently making PCB's in a stand alone mode without making a compatible schematic first. Of course this was the "way it's done" in the paper, purely photographic, and Bishop Graphics days. PC boards were designed the same way at Motorola too, because CAD tools and the computer to run them on simply didn't exist in the 1970's. A team of a dozen or more people all worked on the board for a walkie talkie with some in charge of the schematic, and some in charge of the board. All of my PCB's were done this way, and yes some ugly time consuming mistakes were made that resulted in ripping up a good portion of a 32 KB memory board for the SWTPC SS-50 bus computer that I did in Bishop Graphics tape on mylar.
The component library and schematic entry is a pain for a simple board until you get used to that kind of workflow, but it will save you time and mistakes in the long term. Is it always necessary? No. Eagle, Mentor Graphics, and even Cadence PCB tools can be faked out and used in "polygon pusher mode" without a schematic. You are on your own and everything you do will generate some sort of error message, but it works. I don't know enough about KiCad yet to try this.
In Eagle I simply made a user library of an assortment of round, octagonal and square pads. You could open a PCB, drop pads from this library wherever you wanted, then connect them with a line (not a wire). You will get the dreaded warning that the board and schematic are not consistent, but you can ignore it. Output Gerbers or print directly to transfer paper, done! Eagle 5.11 and lower always ran fine on low spec PC's for me.
I have found that most of the netlist errors in a cad tool like Eagle or KiCad in this case come from duplicate pin names or wires crossing close to or on top of part pins. The unintended connection may not appear instantly when this mistake is made. See posts #157, 162, 163, 164 and 165 here for details:
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/schade-common-gate-scg-preamp.380487/page-8
No connects in Eagle are often generated by off grid parts or wires. When you make your own symbol for a part use a grid. Use the same or smaller grid that is an integer multiple of that grid for making a schematic, and use "snap to grid" when placing or connecting symbols.
Huh, I am using it (KiCad)! At least, I can tell myself I have drawn the first extremely simple schematic... Running the Electrical Rules Test, or whatever it is called, fails, although according to me, the schematic is complete. For those who use it, the errors are:
Refers to the input connection which needs a signal source.
Refers to the ground and power rails.
Like my grumbling when I first attempted to use LTSpice, never mind I am an old hag, I am slowwwwwly succ...ceeding. Ask Mooly whether I used to complain, or more accurately, grumble!
Code:
Pin not connected
Code:
Pin 1 not drivenLike my grumbling when I first attempted to use LTSpice, never mind I am an old hag, I am slowwwwwly succ...ceeding. Ask Mooly whether I used to complain, or more accurately, grumble!
Have to check each footprint carefully when using them though. I've had to redo several boards because the footprint had wrong dimensions or otherwise faulty. For example I've had diodes that had the silkscreen reversed, IEC connectors with the wrong hole spacing, transistors with the wrong footprint and so on. And that is with the 'system' and 'LCSC' footprints, let alone the 'user supplied' footprints.
Having to redo boards because of a dodgy footprint definitely sucks some of the fun out of DIY but once the footprints are verified, I favourite them (or fix them) then it's better next time.
Well, I am one of the couple forumites mentioned who use the PC screen as-if it were "electronic" Bishop patterns and tapes 😱
Still using DOS era Protel Autotrax 1.61 which is free and powerful, only without ANY bells and whistles.
Main point for me and that´s why I mention it here, is that it does not use component lists at all. 😱
What they call components list, in fact is a list of patterns, you may very well call them footprints, not related in any way to any specific component you can buy in a shop.
So if I am designing a Guitar preamp PCB and I am adding a dual Op Amp, I do NOT need to browse through an ever expanding list of thousands of Op Amps but simply choose "DIP 8" and place it on the board, as simple as that.
Same with any other component, say "1/4W resistor", "DO7 diode", "TO92", etc. , we are talking a couple dozen patterns here, to which I added own created "Pot 16" (16mm generic potentiometer), "220-5-V" which applies to any TO220 5 pin chipamp (TDA20**) and so on, any of which can be created in 10 minutes tops, basically consisting of some pads and an outline.
I draw schematic by hand on a piece of paper, can use some simple schematic editor such as free and simple Express PCB Sch module if I need a neater image (which I often use to post here), then place parts one by one , as mentioned above "where they are needed" and then draw tracks.
Which were pre-solved on paper using pencil and most important, a good architect´s rubber/eraser .... call it "rip and reroute" if you wish. 😉
Guess my classic (polite way of saying "dated" 🙁 ) method approaches what you want.
Not suggesting you get that backwards, I use it because I come from a strong pattern-and-tape-on-mylar Bishop Graphics background plus modern systems do not cover the large PCBs used in Musical Instrument systems, I mentioned 60 cm wide preamps which almost none covers unless you get the expensive PRO version ... and even so .....
And to get the huge board capability you have to accept also the tons of (in my view) bloatware, about which I feel the same as you.
Autotrax 1.61 accepts up to 32" by 32" boards, go figure, THE most important factor in my choice (besides ease of use).
That said, again not recommending it for you , but I bet there are quite a few "hobby" packages which can be used in the "straight to PCB" method.
Two which come to mind are PCB Wizard and Sprint Layout.
They do have modern type parts libraries, but those can be downsized/simplified big time by creating a new "favorites" one, where you copypaste parts YOU use, and rename them with generic names such as "741" , "TL072" , "1/4W|resistor" , "200 ceramic" (meaning a ceramic cap with 200 mil/0.2" pin/pad separation, etc.
You will "waste" 1 or 2 afternoons browsing through the kilometric component lists to pick and copy what you will use into your personal parts lists, and then it´s easy peasy.
My view is that there has never been a better time for this hobby than the present! If you want to learn, there's enough books available from highly knowledgeable writers for basically pizza money (OK, a large pizza). The choice of very high quality, reliable and low cost parts never was so extensive as before, even if you are into tubes. For a reasonable outlay you can equip your home lab with equipment even research outfits could only dream of a few decades ago.
Count your blessings!
Jan
Jan, I agree on this, however, regarding parts availability and price, times are getting worse for DIYers. The portfolio of output power devices is reduced, input stage JFEts have disappeared. Good capacitors are more expensive with purchase amount low limits. A lot of silicon parts are produced 1-2x a year with long lead time. You, as a successful circuit assembler and project implementer must be aware of this fact 😉. I assume you do not stick with theoretical circuit analysis and recommendations 😉. This is DIY, the aim is to build a working sample, rather than to debate only.
Partly. Unless you have an emotional 'audiophile' attachment to a specific opamp, for instance, it's easy to find equivalents in case one is out of stock. Same with passive parts. The past year I have often hit a wall that the part I normally use had a 50+ week delivery, but in all caes it was easy to find an alternative.
But if you are limited to Mouser, or if you feel you absolutely need this Rubicon 100uF 35V cap or otherwise your amp will sound like crap, yes in that case you're f*cked 😎
But that's largely self-inflicted.
Jan
But if you are limited to Mouser, or if you feel you absolutely need this Rubicon 100uF 35V cap or otherwise your amp will sound like crap, yes in that case you're f*cked 😎
But that's largely self-inflicted.
Jan
I expect that an intelligent man as you are knows what I speak about. Underestimation is not needed. Would you kindly post links to your amplifier projects that you have completed in the past years resulting in finished audio components?
I don't know how that relates to my view of the hobby, but why not.
It was more test equipment, only one amp, the electrostatic direct drive HV amp.
I am finishing it up for an audio show in the fall.
I may publish it after then ;-)
Jan
Attachments
Pavel,
One of the joys of part shortages is some folks double or triple order the parts they need from different suppliers and the cancel the other orders after the first one ships the parts.
Then others expecting issues order well in advance and place the parts into inventory.
Of course this does result in parts being out of stock at the moment.
One of the parts I use is now quoted at a lead time of a year and a day. Ordering them in anticipation of a need Digikey required prepayment. A very reasonable response to avoid the double-triple order problem from their point of view. However as I anticipate actually needing the parts I did prepay for them.
I will be doing a redesign to avoid that part in the future. The nice issue is that when I did the original design I allowed for an input voltage range of 12 to 60 volts. Turns out all the users either supply 12 or 15 volts DC. So I can use more available parts to make a voltage doubler to get the voltage required. The big advantage is this drops the current requirement to low enough that it can be supplied in a much easier set up.
BTW the order was for 500 units at a bit under $15 each. I expect to need 5,000 units in about a year. Do you think supplies will be back to normal by then?
One of the joys of part shortages is some folks double or triple order the parts they need from different suppliers and the cancel the other orders after the first one ships the parts.
Then others expecting issues order well in advance and place the parts into inventory.
Of course this does result in parts being out of stock at the moment.
One of the parts I use is now quoted at a lead time of a year and a day. Ordering them in anticipation of a need Digikey required prepayment. A very reasonable response to avoid the double-triple order problem from their point of view. However as I anticipate actually needing the parts I did prepay for them.
I will be doing a redesign to avoid that part in the future. The nice issue is that when I did the original design I allowed for an input voltage range of 12 to 60 volts. Turns out all the users either supply 12 or 15 volts DC. So I can use more available parts to make a voltage doubler to get the voltage required. The big advantage is this drops the current requirement to low enough that it can be supplied in a much easier set up.
BTW the order was for 500 units at a bit under $15 each. I expect to need 5,000 units in about a year. Do you think supplies will be back to normal by then?
My current record quoted delivery stands at 99 weeks ...
I have double ordered and cancelled after the first delivery without problems but these were small orders only.
I also did a few designs for two different parts with the same function (DC-DC converters), allowing for simple configuration for either part on the PCB.
(These were TPS5402 and TPS54331).
Jan
I have double ordered and cancelled after the first delivery without problems but these were small orders only.
I also did a few designs for two different parts with the same function (DC-DC converters), allowing for simple configuration for either part on the PCB.
(These were TPS5402 and TPS54331).
Jan
Jan,
It is only 99 weeks because their method of listing back orders only allows 2 digits!
It is only 99 weeks because their method of listing back orders only allows 2 digits!
Very true, and unfortunately, this goes far beyond electronics parts for a DIY hobby. Supermarkets with empty shelves, and eye-watering price increases in the prices of basic necessities (meat, veggies) have hit everyone I know in the last couple of years.
My experience there is quite different from yours - replacement tubes for my two commercially manufactured guitar amplifiers have become virtually unavailable.jan.didden said:
I tried to buy a Raspberry Pi 4 last week, and found I would have to wait until at least late November 2022 to get one.
It's not just me. Even Fender, the 800-lb gorilla of North American guitar amplifier manufacturing, issued a press release stating that they had to cut down on both tube and solid-state guitar amplifier production, because of shortages of vacuum tubes and DSP/microcontroller chips.
For good or bad, COVID-19 has also shut down my need for my vacuum tube electric guitar amps, as I now need to keep my guitar quiet enough for an apartment surrounded by white-haired seniors, many in frail health.
-Gnobuddy
FPGA modules are also in very short supply now. For example, in late 2020, acg bought up the entire world stock of Trenz Electronic TE0630 LX75 modules, that is, he bought both of them.
When you now look at the Trenz Electronic site, you see that almost everything has 0 stock and that you have to call them for an indication of when things will be available again.
When you now look at the Trenz Electronic site, you see that almost everything has 0 stock and that you have to call them for an indication of when things will be available again.
Last edited:
I showed a picture of a Panasonic boom box that has followed me around for about 25 years. I still have it but have not used it in a long time. I mentioned that it was used as the amp for a fancy Roland JV-1000 music keyboard that we bought for our daughter when she was in high school. It cost over $2500 in the mid 1990s. I remembered that it too had followed me around for over 25 years, so I dug it out of its hiding place in the basement only to discover possibly the world's worst case of "Roland red glue disease." As many as 8 keys in a row had glued themselves together. Google, Youtube and other internet sources revealed that curing this disease involved completely disassembling the JV and then completely disassembling its keybed. After that, each key gets soaked in hot drain cleaner or a similar seriously strong alkali. I had to use drain cleaner spiked with pure lye (Sodium Hydroxide). All drippings of the red glue that was in places that could not be soaked needed some persuasion with an X-acto knife or a hot soldering iron. It took two weeks of two sessions a day limited in duration by my patience, but the JV-1000 is now fully functional.
Sometimes DIY audio is not about building......it's also about rebuilding. Now, on to the Panasonic......NOT. It actually still works but I like the Roland's sound better through a little Lepai chip amp from Parts Express that plays into a pair of DIY MTM cabinets built with Parts Express drivers. I need to build a powered sub to hit those 20.6 Hz low E notes. The Polk Audio box I have just farts in the wind at anything below about 35 Hz. The Sennheisers don't like it either.
