This was about a power switch. These are probably still easy to source in Europe.
Anatech should provide a picture.
Anatech should provide a picture.
He already repaired it with a better switch and described that in the same post.
Switches, potentiometers… Both used to be pretty mediocre by that brand. That is what I emphasised.
The extension rods and hardware (couplers/chassis mount bearings) they fitted on their stuff were indestructible though. Still use those and these are very old.
Switches, potentiometers… Both used to be pretty mediocre by that brand. That is what I emphasised.
The extension rods and hardware (couplers/chassis mount bearings) they fitted on their stuff were indestructible though. Still use those and these are very old.
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Nice reading about this Philips scope and the switch :
http://www.hifimuseum.de/3359.html
If I write it is easy to source does not mean to belittle the repair attempt.
It is not wrong to use a mediocre switch in a modest scope.
You emphasized volume controls.
http://www.hifimuseum.de/3359.html
If I write it is easy to source does not mean to belittle the repair attempt.
It is not wrong to use a mediocre switch in a modest scope.
You emphasized volume controls.
No it is a fine choice as anatech pointed out 😉 The device regularly dies because of cheap manufacturing. Like many Philips instruments.
No the brand or its quality was the subject.
No the brand or its quality was the subject.
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Thanks JP, yes.
They could have used a standard switch - but no. Looks like they cleared out stock as this one has three poles, one ahead of the rear DPST section. I modified a normal DPST type rated at 5 amperes. It isn't pretty, but it is solid. I used ground lugs to solder wire onto, the screw onto the mounting plate. Every distance, every conductor location was different. I'm not really proud of this, but as everything is falling apart anyway it needed to be solid and reliable, That's it.
The angles aren't great, but there is clearance between conductors and other components. The new switch touches the switching transformer - it just fits. The front support wires had to be ground down to fit the holes in the PCB, they were solid 14 ga. The lugs have SEMS screws and Locktite to keep them in place.
It is full of Philips capacitors (of course) and I expect to replace those also. There is one PCB where it runs way too hot, and has been replaced three times already. They offered a replacement scope, newer. I wouldn't touch it as the exhaust air was almost 20 °C hotter than the inlet temp. Upon opening it there was one huge chip that was far too hot to touch. They could have used a heat sink but elected to shorten it's life. I passed.
They could have used a standard switch - but no. Looks like they cleared out stock as this one has three poles, one ahead of the rear DPST section. I modified a normal DPST type rated at 5 amperes. It isn't pretty, but it is solid. I used ground lugs to solder wire onto, the screw onto the mounting plate. Every distance, every conductor location was different. I'm not really proud of this, but as everything is falling apart anyway it needed to be solid and reliable, That's it.
The angles aren't great, but there is clearance between conductors and other components. The new switch touches the switching transformer - it just fits. The front support wires had to be ground down to fit the holes in the PCB, they were solid 14 ga. The lugs have SEMS screws and Locktite to keep them in place.
It is full of Philips capacitors (of course) and I expect to replace those also. There is one PCB where it runs way too hot, and has been replaced three times already. They offered a replacement scope, newer. I wouldn't touch it as the exhaust air was almost 20 °C hotter than the inlet temp. Upon opening it there was one huge chip that was far too hot to touch. They could have used a heat sink but elected to shorten it's life. I passed.
Attachments
My small museum of electrical instruments contains no Philips ones. Their eighties stuff was too much of a disappointment. Especially the pulverizing plastics.
Agreed JP. I was used to 1970's equipment, maybe 1960's lol! Before plastic. This blind-sided me.
A service manual for the Philips scope is on Elektrotanya.
The power switch is made by Preh I think, not Piher.
The power switch is made by Preh I think, not Piher.
Preh was not much better unfortunately. Curious as their parts looked sturdy but also nearly always crackled or had bad contact (the switches). When going to a radio store those 2 brands products were in stock 🙂 There was a third brand of push switches that very often failed but I forgot the name. Already in that time one wanted Lorlin or better for switches and Noble/Alps for potentiometers. I think everybody remembers the sliding potentiometers.
Edit: it were Shadow push switches.
Despite the strong "older is better" vibe in our hobby I nearly forgot that it was fully normal to hear changing volume in the loudspeakers even without signals! Then off to the shop and getting the very same brand/type potentiometer 😀 We quickly learned to find and use surplus military stuff.
Edit: it were Shadow push switches.
Despite the strong "older is better" vibe in our hobby I nearly forgot that it was fully normal to hear changing volume in the loudspeakers even without signals! Then off to the shop and getting the very same brand/type potentiometer 😀 We quickly learned to find and use surplus military stuff.
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Hi as_audio,
I think you may be right. Going off memory. Both those brands are garbage as far as I'm concerned. I hate seeing them in equipment. The fact remains, the really cheap power switch failed mechanically, it never got abused. It was a non-standard layout. Why they didn't use standard parts escapes me since it creates just another skew. It increases service costs and when they can't get the part the unit is not repairable (which may be the point). From a service standpoint, Philips were nasty to their customers. Cheap unobtainium with very low spares inventory. Now there is a company that richly deserves to be completely out of business.
I have the original manuals that were included when I bought it. Also the downloads, thank you. The downloaded material is not complete.
Hi JP,
I dislike Lorlin switches. Intermittent would be a good description, and cheap feeling. Popular due to their low price. I tried to use them. In the end after years I had to replace all of them - everywhere in equipment I designed. Selecting the number of positions was neat, too bad the switch contacts were not very good. Not compared to the wafer switches I am use to using.
I think you may be right. Going off memory. Both those brands are garbage as far as I'm concerned. I hate seeing them in equipment. The fact remains, the really cheap power switch failed mechanically, it never got abused. It was a non-standard layout. Why they didn't use standard parts escapes me since it creates just another skew. It increases service costs and when they can't get the part the unit is not repairable (which may be the point). From a service standpoint, Philips were nasty to their customers. Cheap unobtainium with very low spares inventory. Now there is a company that richly deserves to be completely out of business.
I have the original manuals that were included when I bought it. Also the downloads, thank you. The downloaded material is not complete.
Hi JP,
I dislike Lorlin switches. Intermittent would be a good description, and cheap feeling. Popular due to their low price. I tried to use them. In the end after years I had to replace all of them - everywhere in equipment I designed. Selecting the number of positions was neat, too bad the switch contacts were not very good. Not compared to the wafer switches I am use to using.
Lorlin was among the cheapest/reasonable quality at the low side of switches then. At the other end Elma which are high end compared to the others. At a price. There were also EAO Swiss and French brands but these were outside reach for DIYers. After a few attempts and after a while one usually learns and chooses good stuff.
I also know the Preh and Piher brands from TV set repair. Many Philips chassis (K40 I think somewhere in the nineties) had mains switch problems too and there even was a massive recall action as they caused fires. Every repairmen had these in stock as they failed a lot. The switch was failing even in powered off condition as it was directly connected to the mains cable AFAIK.
I also know the Preh and Piher brands from TV set repair. Many Philips chassis (K40 I think somewhere in the nineties) had mains switch problems too and there even was a massive recall action as they caused fires. Every repairmen had these in stock as they failed a lot. The switch was failing even in powered off condition as it was directly connected to the mains cable AFAIK.
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So the "Phier switch" has grown from Piher to Preh, quite different companies.
I tend to disagree. The mains switch was produced in millions and frequently
seen in tv sets etc so it can be called a standard part. It is still available today
here and there. The Philips repairman had spares in his drawer. No idea how
old the scope was until the switch failed, but everything technical will be defunct
sooner or later.
I see no reason to call items like this garbage and for general Piher, Preh, Philips
bashing.
I tend to disagree. The mains switch was produced in millions and frequently
seen in tv sets etc so it can be called a standard part. It is still available today
here and there. The Philips repairman had spares in his drawer. No idea how
old the scope was until the switch failed, but everything technical will be defunct
sooner or later.
I see no reason to call items like this garbage and for general Piher, Preh, Philips
bashing.
I wondered why anyone would bother fixing a Philips 'scope, but I looked it up and found it was a final generation analogue 'scope with cursors. Oscilloscope manufacture went through a bad patch in the 90s; digital 'scopes were s-l-o-w (HP54600) and analogue 'scopes (Tek TAS465) had soft and soggy CRTs. But at the end of the 90s, the Tek TDS3000 series appeared and they were wonderful. They had ADCs that allowed one-shot bandwidth equal to their attenuators, and their ergonomics had been thought through (unlike all previous digital 'scopes). I bought one and still consider it to be the gold standard for ergonomics.
Repair yesterday kenwood KA-5700 the owner say the sound lost from one or the other channel randomly and bad sound quality.I recap all capacitors and instal two bigger main filter caps from 6800mf to 10000mf refresh the solder joints and the nice looking amp works perfect.
Tell me a single "audio device" with Piher volume control.
"Phier" was probably a result of autocorrection.
"Phier" was probably a result of autocorrection.
Piher is an Amphenol company now.
Preh got taken over by their Chinese suppliers, who were earlier given the technology to make Preh branded products in China.
Same with Bosch power tools, their long term Chinese supplier was given the brand rights, as the Germans did not want to be in a low margin business.
Philips themselves have gone out of consumer products like TV and audio, preferring high margin medical and personal systems. They spun off the lighting division as a company called Signify.
No idea if they still make stuff like scopes.
Same thing, or similar has happened to many European brands like Quad, NAD, Harman, and many others.
No ties to any names above.
Preh got taken over by their Chinese suppliers, who were earlier given the technology to make Preh branded products in China.
Same with Bosch power tools, their long term Chinese supplier was given the brand rights, as the Germans did not want to be in a low margin business.
Philips themselves have gone out of consumer products like TV and audio, preferring high margin medical and personal systems. They spun off the lighting division as a company called Signify.
No idea if they still make stuff like scopes.
Same thing, or similar has happened to many European brands like Quad, NAD, Harman, and many others.
No ties to any names above.
Whatever they are called, I don't really care. Those components are substandard. Philips as a company was never concerned with quality and always got away with whatever they could.
Sadly, the performance of those oscilloscopes I have that were made by Philips was excellent. However, doomed by component and construction quality. Too bad, most of the engineering was pretty good. They did have about the best oscilloscope CRTs at the time.
Sadly, the performance of those oscilloscopes I have that were made by Philips was excellent. However, doomed by component and construction quality. Too bad, most of the engineering was pretty good. They did have about the best oscilloscope CRTs at the time.
Oh, OK : it's not Audio for the moment... But I will return to Audio, of course !
Restoration of two O Gauge engines : a PAYA "Norte" #1105 (green, made in Spain), and an IVES #1694 (Tan, made in USA) 🙂
T
Restoration of two O Gauge engines : a PAYA "Norte" #1105 (green, made in Spain), and an IVES #1694 (Tan, made in USA) 🙂
T