High-End DIY Three Way Speaker

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EirikDyrset

Member
Joined 2020
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digitalthor

Member
Joined 2018
I dont understand the Tang Band woofer?
I would go for the Seas DXT tweeter, a 4-5" midrange like the RS150 and a SB WO24 woofer.
You get good directivity with a rather simple cut in the front - beveled, and a nice integration between drivers. Also remember, this amplifier is not that strong with low impedance, when playing loud. But besides that, you should be good.
 
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Dave Bullet

Member
Joined 2002
Both tang band and tweeter will need up to 6dB of attenuation to match the woofer.

I haven't seen distortion plots of the tang band but would be surprised if other similar pure midrange or midwoofers aren't as good in your intended operating range at half the cost (and better matched system sensitivity). Basically you are paying a premium for a full range driver for capability you don't need.
 
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Ray Tremblay

Member
Joined 2010
The tweeter you've selected is one of the very best available and definitely fits with the "High-End" theme. The Hypex Ncore DSP amplifier is also extremely high end. But the Tang Band full range driver and the Dayton woofer aren't in the same realm.

Just my opinion, you should seriously consider the Satori MR13 mid range
Looking for a SB Acoustics MR13P-4 woofer? - SoundImports
and the Satori WO24 woofer
Looking for a SB Acoustics WO24P-4 woofer? - SoundImports

Those three drivers with the Hypex 3 way DSP amplifier would give you a very high end system that can easily be expanded on in the future without replacing anything, only adding to it.
 
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digitalthor

Member
Joined 2018
Ray Tremblay said:
Can you please elaborate.
Click to expand...
We were simply a group of hifi-guys who met, and one of them brought his new DIY speaker. It used the slightly bigger Fusion FA253 for a Scanspeak tweeter, 6" Satori midrange and two [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]SB SW26DBAC76-3-DV.When playing a little loud, the subwoofers started to sound a very weird. It simply sounded like the amplifier ran out of juice. But it should be noted, that I cannot remember how he hooked up the drivers. They both went in and out at the same time - placed opposite the cabinet - but what impedance the amplifier saw, I simply can't remember.
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digitalthor

Member
Joined 2018
EirikDyrset said:
Thanks for your feedback @digitalthor!

My plan for the Tang Band-woofer is to utilize its good mid-range performance, and have crossover-points at 200 Hz and roughly around 2000 Hz. Why is that a bad idea?
Click to expand...
First off, it's to big. It will start beaming before the tweeters takes over fully, so that you will get a dispersion pattern that looks like a christmas tree. B&W suffer from this just by using a 7" midrange, because of the beaming effect. As the size of a driver increase, the higher frequencies start to only play forward in space, and not to the sides. When combining a larger midrange with a non waveguided tweeter, you get a sharp shift in the response to the sides, which is very easily heard as a dull upper midrange in this situation.
Paper also have a different signature than the aluminium from Dayton that I mention.
Paper sounds more natural to some, but often lack detail and clarity. Aluminium has more detail and clarity, but you need to filter out the breakup, which I find easy - especially with an active filter.
 
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EirikDyrset

Member
Joined 2020
Ray Tremblay said:
The tweeter you've selected is one of the very best available and definitely fits with the "High-End" theme. The Hypex Ncore DSP amplifier is also extremely high end. But the Tang Band full range driver and the Dayton woofer aren't in the same realm.

Just my opinion, you should seriously consider the Satori MR13 mid range
Looking for a SB Acoustics MR13P-4 woofer? - SoundImports
and the Satori WO24 woofer
Looking for a SB Acoustics WO24P-4 woofer? - SoundImports

Those three drivers with the Hypex 3 way DSP amplifier would give you a very high end system that can easily be expanded on in the future without replacing anything, only adding to it.
Click to expand...

Thanks for your feedback - much appreciated!

SB Acoustics MR13P-4:
Have you any experience with this driver? It was a little bit cheap compared to the tang band, so I thought maybe it is of lower quality? What crossover point would you recommend for this one?

Satori WO24:
Have you any experience using this? The Fs was "only" 28 Hz, do you of anyother high-end driver with lower Fs?

Best regards
Eirik Dyrset
 
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EirikDyrset

Member
Joined 2020
digitalthor said:
First off, it's to big. It will start beaming before the tweeters takes over fully, so that you will get a dispersion pattern that looks like a christmas tree. B&W suffer from this just by using a 7" midrange, because of the beaming effect. As the size of a driver increase, the higher frequencies start to only play forward in space, and not to the sides. When combining a larger midrange with a non waveguided tweeter, you get a sharp shift in the response to the sides, which is very easily heard as a dull upper midrange in this situation.
Paper also have a different signature than the aluminium from Dayton that I mention.
Paper sounds more natural to some, but often lack detail and clarity. Aluminium has more detail and clarity, but you need to filter out the breakup, which I find easy - especially with an active filter.
Click to expand...

Thanks for you feedback mister!

Based on the frequency response curve from the datasheet from the Tang Band-driver it should not have _ANY_ problem playing nice from 200 Hz to 2000 Hz, have I misunderstood anything here? To me, the Tang Band-driver seems like a very good choice based on the datasheet. Please help me understand why it's a bad choice.
 
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digitalthor

Member
Joined 2018
EirikDyrset said:
Thanks for you feedback mister!

Based on the frequency response curve from the datasheet from the Tang Band-driver it should not have _ANY_ problem playing nice from 200 Hz to 2000 Hz, have I misunderstood anything here? To me, the Tang Band-driver seems like a very good choice based on the datasheet. Please help me understand why it's a bad choice.
Click to expand...
Your welcome :) Simply put, the Tang Band is a fullrange driver, not a midrange - a drivers that tries to do everything at once.... a bigger compromise.
But you can't cheat physics. The specs say nothing about off-axis response, which is very important to judge the final sound signature of a speaker. KEF, Revel, Kii3, JBL M2 among others, have gained great praise from music-lovers all over the world - namely because they play well and have an even smooth power response.
Inspiration here:
DXT-MON | 5 ″ 1 ″ | Near field monitor | Compact speaker
You'll notice that the frequency response is smooth both on and off axis. Since we listen to music in rooms, not outdoors. You will hear a lot of reflections from the sealing, floor and walls/furniture around your listening position. This is why it is important that these reflections has the same sound signature as the direct sound from the speaker. A speaker with an even and smooth dispersion pattern, sounds better and more natural/neutral, than other poorly designed speakers.
The Tang Band is also expensive and will never give you the quality sound reproduction, as a smaller dedicated midrange driver - when properly implemented in a good design.
The WO24 is good, because it can easily meet a smaller midrange around 4-500hz and if given a good box - will play deep enough. You can have deep, loud or small sized bass. But you can only chose 2 at a time. So if you want a driver to play deep in a small box, you lose sensitivity(not loud).
Almost no normal speaker plays very deep quality bass. This is where subwoofers come into play. They can be placed much better with respect to acoustical challenges, than speakers that need to be places for optimum stereo. They also do not need to play higher up in frequency.
3 or 4 way speakers are the minimum for high quality stereo sound reproduction. A single driver like the Tang Band is simply too big a compromise for high quality sound. It may sound nice in some cases - but it will always be a compromise in comparison.
 
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EirikDyrset

Member
Joined 2020
Thanks for a solid reply and good explanations.

So, what do you think about this setup:
- Looking for a SB Acoustics TW29RN-B-8 tweeter? - SoundImports
- Looking for a SB Acoustics MR13P-4 woofer? - SoundImports
- Looking for a SB Acoustics WO24P-4 woofer? - SoundImports

Do you think this can be a solid match?

To be honest I would really like to have a little bit bigger woofer, preferably a 12" - do you have any good suggestions here? You said that DS315 was maybe not a good choice, do you know of any other solid woofers in 12" size range?
 
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digitalthor

Member
Joined 2018
I personally find soft cone/dome drivers a bit lacking in detail. But it's a matter of taste. Paper do sound a bit more laid back and "natural" to some - which I respect - even though I do not prefer it myself.
Also remember that most drivers are pretty good. Implementation, filtering and EQ is VERY important to get the best out of any driver. With EQ, I mean both the EQ needed to shape the anechoic response, and the EQ needed to tame the bass in the listening position.
 
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