2.5 dB less sensitive means probably a crossover re-design which I am not prepared to do. Right now I also do not have the resources to do active crossover, but may in the future. Thanks Dave for the updated info. I should have seen the efficiency difference myself.
For now I will continue to listen and run the speakers until they are fully broken in and re-evaluate.
-david BTW
For now I will continue to listen and run the speakers until they are fully broken in and re-evaluate.
-david BTW
Just a short followup. I am listening to these nearly every day as I work on many other things. I am still pleased and happy that I built these even though it took forever. For my kind of music and listening taste these Halcyons are very pleasant to listen to. I would recommend them for sure! They get better every day. I am a bit surprised as despite their shortcomings they are better than I expected after all the work.
Here is a photo of one of my speakers on the right side of my media center cabinet. On the top is one of my North Creek Music Kitty Kats which I built more than 10 years ago. They are amazing for their size.
But the Halcyons below have a much better low end and that cohesive full-range sound that I like very much. I am driving these with a product I designed in my full time job that will deliver 120W into 4 ohms with AKM DACs. I will send a photo of my full media center when I get it set up presentable for a photo.
Here is a photo of one of my speakers on the right side of my media center cabinet. On the top is one of my North Creek Music Kitty Kats which I built more than 10 years ago. They are amazing for their size.
But the Halcyons below have a much better low end and that cohesive full-range sound that I like very much. I am driving these with a product I designed in my full time job that will deliver 120W into 4 ohms with AKM DACs. I will send a photo of my full media center when I get it set up presentable for a photo.
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Very nice, davebtw!
I'm having issues with mine but think it is due to room interaction. Moved into a new place and the bass no longer shakes the foundation. Going to poke at it this weekend to see if something happened during the move.
After that, going to revisit the design all-together. Given the lack of availability of the original SB woofers, I'm ready to try my hand at a redesign with either the MarkAudio 12PW or the Satori MW19P replacing the SBs. All new cabinets and new crossover but it is time to actually build something from scratch instead of kitting it up.
I'm having issues with mine but think it is due to room interaction. Moved into a new place and the bass no longer shakes the foundation. Going to poke at it this weekend to see if something happened during the move.
After that, going to revisit the design all-together. Given the lack of availability of the original SB woofers, I'm ready to try my hand at a redesign with either the MarkAudio 12PW or the Satori MW19P replacing the SBs. All new cabinets and new crossover but it is time to actually build something from scratch instead of kitting it up.
Here is a photo of the finished Crossover just before mounting on the bottom of the cabinet. Also a photo of how I split up the feeds for the bass drivers and the A10p on top. I used speakon connectors. So far they are working just fine, but of course they keep me from putting the speakers right against the wall. However, in my room, they really need to be as far back as possible as the Halcyons are pretty deep speakers. So I am prepared for the possible fiddling with an external DSP crossover etc.
I have been considering switching to a different full range driver as I mentioned earlier in the thread. But I am going to live with these for now and let them break in etc. I have always had a serious case of Up-Grade-Itis when it comes to audio stuff. But now that I am retired, there is not the cash flow there once was. Perhaps I will need to do more consulting to make up the difference.
-david BTW
I have been considering switching to a different full range driver as I mentioned earlier in the thread. But I am going to live with these for now and let them break in etc. I have always had a serious case of Up-Grade-Itis when it comes to audio stuff. But now that I am retired, there is not the cash flow there once was. Perhaps I will need to do more consulting to make up the difference.
-david BTW
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I think my next steps need to be getting some measurement equipment. Find out if I'm hearing similar and decide the next steps.
Been unhappy with the sound of the system after moving to a new place. Even the GF has commented that she doesn't enjoy listening to it anymore. I made some time tonight to do a quick measurement with AudioTools running on my iPhone. Totally not very scientific but here's the measured response to pink noise at 1m with the iPhone on-axis with the MA Alpair 10p:
Pretty significant dip at 500Hz. This was measured in the listening room, no special test setup other than holding the phone on-axis at 1m. I'm going to check polarity one more time.
Does anyone have any other suggestions/thoughts?
Pretty significant dip at 500Hz. This was measured in the listening room, no special test setup other than holding the phone on-axis at 1m. I'm going to check polarity one more time.
Does anyone have any other suggestions/thoughts?
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Put the speaker up on a 12" tall platform in the middle of the living room.
iPhone was set on axis with the A10p at 1m.
Living room dimensions are roughly 14.5 ft long x 12.5ft wide x 9ft tall.
Getting a double dip depression from roughly 100 to 500 Hz.
Not sure of the test setup given I haven't fully read up on AudioTools and measuring stuff.
Next step is to run the MA A10P full bandwidth and see how it measures. Maybe tonight or tomorrow.
iPhone was set on axis with the A10p at 1m.
Living room dimensions are roughly 14.5 ft long x 12.5ft wide x 9ft tall.
Getting a double dip depression from roughly 100 to 500 Hz.
Not sure of the test setup given I haven't fully read up on AudioTools and measuring stuff.
Next step is to run the MA A10P full bandwidth and see how it measures. Maybe tonight or tomorrow.
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Have had no time to work on these but something changed. Last weekend I started swapping 1stWatt F4 clone boards into one of the monsterblock amps. As I was down a channel, I hooked up the remaining amp in stereo mode. The Halcyon's are back to sounding like I remember in the house in Colorado. Haven't taken measurements to see what changed but back to sitting and listening on a regular basis.
Will be driving it directly off of a Benchmark DAC3.
Forgot to specify the still-operating amp has F6 boards in it. Don't know if adding the common mode noise back in (i.e. switching from balanced to single-ended input operation) has done the trick. Maybe also the change in damping factor and gain. Either way, the system is much closer to enjoyable again. Acoustic treatments are still needed but the evening wind-down has turned into putting on an album and giving it a good listen.
Forgot to specify the still-operating amp has F6 boards in it. Don't know if adding the common mode noise back in (i.e. switching from balanced to single-ended input operation) has done the trick. Maybe also the change in damping factor and gain. Either way, the system is much closer to enjoyable again. Acoustic treatments are still needed but the evening wind-down has turned into putting on an album and giving it a good listen.
Very curious I am anxious to learn what is going on. I haven’t compared my different amps but have been driving mine from 120 watt class D amp using a TI chipset I designed about 6 years ago. One of these days I will try my Benchmark AHB2. I am also restoring a pair of mono block El 84 amps and am most curious to hear those. Please keep posting!
Yes, with these Speaker design works designs, acoustic treatments seem to be a key detail. I have absorptive treatments at the moment but plan to put diffusion on the wall behind the speakers to diffuse the rear-firing wave. If you can do it, cloud panels on the ceiling do make a surprising difference. I did that in my room on the ceiling first reflection points and was surprised as to how much it effected the sound.
I see what you meant. stereo F6 vs bridged. I personally liked mine with the IRFP150's. I used the IR ones from Arrow.com. They seem to have good prices on them. I haven't tried the Vishay's but I assume they would be the same story. The bass was a little tighter with them.
I see what you meant. stereo F6 vs bridged. I personally liked mine with the IRFP150's. I used the IR ones from Arrow.com. They seem to have good prices on them. I haven't tried the Vishay's but I assume they would be the same story. The bass was a little tighter with them.
I should also have said that I have Benchmark DAC 3 HGC driving the benchmark amp in balanced mode. I need to listen to that for a while. As I said previously I find the Halcyons very pleasant to listen to at low to medium levels.