I have not yet see a danley with a full range in stead of a compression driver.
the danley are also conical, so beam is more flipped, I think for in a home it do work fine, want you loud maybe then you get problem, then a compression driver is better, but I think the mids will do the same because of the woofers.
A coil over a speaker is not what make a amp happy so you mean a network, a aktief system will also work with high damping amps like a super emittor follower powerstage who is very low ohm and speaker see schort circuit. for me a analog system I have to examinate.
thanks for information.
kees
No.
For a given cutoff frequency and throat area, a fully-formed spherical wave horn (90 degree mouth flare tangent angle) will be longer, and have a larger mouth area, than the equivalent tractrix horn.
Hi David everything oke?
And is there some profit what concerns bandwidth?
I did try with hornresp but then I have no wizard to see what happens with drawn. If the tractrix do so well it is maybe a idea to extent program furter with it so it more easy to make it in stead of akabak who is pretty complicated.
regards
Hi Kees,
Try simulating both horn types. I think you will find that the difference is minimal.
See my Post #5214 in the Hornresp thread. It also applies to spherical wave horns.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subwoofers/119854-hornresp-522.html#post4202190
Kind regards,
David
Try simulating both horn types. I think you will find that the difference is minimal.
See my Post #5214 in the Hornresp thread. It also applies to spherical wave horns.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subwoofers/119854-hornresp-522.html#post4202190
Kind regards,
David
Kees,
How close are you to a design that you will build? This speaker is actually quite easy to build in foam core as the two others who attempted were able to do (Unahm did it with plastic panels ). Drawing the curve on the flat and bending the curve to follow lets the horn self assemble. I am not sure you will gain much by redesigning from scratch. You can just sale my pdf plan to match your new throat size - should work fine. You will save yourself a lot of work that I put in to develop those plans. That was some tricky CAD work to "unroll" the curved tractrix to a flat sheet to cut. If you are handy with 3d CAD then fine but most folks may not know how to do that.
How close are you to a design that you will build? This speaker is actually quite easy to build in foam core as the two others who attempted were able to do (Unahm did it with plastic panels ). Drawing the curve on the flat and bending the curve to follow lets the horn self assemble. I am not sure you will gain much by redesigning from scratch. You can just sale my pdf plan to match your new throat size - should work fine. You will save yourself a lot of work that I put in to develop those plans. That was some tricky CAD work to "unroll" the curved tractrix to a flat sheet to cut. If you are handy with 3d CAD then fine but most folks may not know how to do that.
Hi
I can work well with 3D cad, like sketchup where I did fold the tapped horns like in early post is mention.
I have this time a problem with nabure and his 6.8 watt wifi mast in roof, not only it keeps me from sleeping wel, it radiate badly in measure equipment for speaker testing/measuring, and so moment I am busy with court who I have won, now to move the mast away from me, Court say so close to that strong microwave is not very healthy, but sadly Holland do also not protect people, but only company,s and sometimes I think I go emigrate but without mony to start with this is difficult.
And now back to horn, I go make the horn of wood, I have a Idea that work and make a rigit one, I go not use plastic, but bendable wood thin and layer it I go make the horn a different way I think more easy, faster and more rigid, I let you now.
I need one thing I can not do well, a akabak script for all two speakers in the synergy apart from each other so I can more easely edit and learn that stuff.
You have experience So I think not a problem, I have other tapped horn so this I have exported from hornresp.
David, I have the same tought about spheric and tractrix that it is both amost the same respons, and I have no profit from spheric and so stay tractrix, respect for people in 1932 who did make this without pc, just be hand, same for cartoons though, more beautifull also tha pc cartoons.
I co soon start I go make it coming week after drawn things the right way.
See some drawns I did make, 3D folding is not a problem for me. came from hornresp export and sims.
Attachments
Kees,
You mean a an akabak script with the tractrix and a sub woofer tapped horn in one script?
It's quite simple to do: make three scripts and get each to work independently (tractrix full range, tractrix bass, and tapped horn sub).
Make a new script where the 'System' definition for the tractrix horn is system 1, a second system for the woofers on the tractrix, and third system for tapped horn. You can only have one section for variables definition at the top to be shared by all 3 systems. Under each system apply a filter to define te crossover - high pass and low pass. Put crossover freq variables into variable definition so that you can quickly change xo freq to check sims. Add an all pass filter to implement time alignment between systems. Use the v0= in each filter to set gain for each system to match levels.
I would post script for you but my PC hard disk just went dead.
You mean a an akabak script with the tractrix and a sub woofer tapped horn in one script?
It's quite simple to do: make three scripts and get each to work independently (tractrix full range, tractrix bass, and tapped horn sub).
Make a new script where the 'System' definition for the tractrix horn is system 1, a second system for the woofers on the tractrix, and third system for tapped horn. You can only have one section for variables definition at the top to be shared by all 3 systems. Under each system apply a filter to define te crossover - high pass and low pass. Put crossover freq variables into variable definition so that you can quickly change xo freq to check sims. Add an all pass filter to implement time alignment between systems. Use the v0= in each filter to set gain for each system to match levels.
I would post script for you but my PC hard disk just went dead.
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Kees,
You mean a an akabak script with the tractrix and a sub woofer tapped horn in one script?
It's quite simple to do: make three scripts and get each to work independently (tractrix full range, tractrix bass, and tapped horn sub).
Make a new script where the 'System' definition for the tractrix horn is system 1, a second system for the woofers on the tractrix, and third system for tapped horn. You can only have one section for variables definition at the top to be shared by all 3 systems. Under each system apply a filter to define te crossover - high pass and low pass. Put crossover freq variables into variable definition so that you can quickly change xo freq to check sims. Add an all pass filter to implement time alignment between systems. Use the v0= in each filter to set gain for each system to match levels.
I would post script for you but my PC hard disk just went dead.
I did mean separate ones indeed, and a dead HD, ughh not nice, loose things, I have a HD who is already 5 years old, do stiil work fine without noise, most when near to end hd makes a noise, then it is time to replace.
If pcb is defect find a same hd and use that pcb, I did that in past one time, and always use a very good en save supply, these are the cause of damage things in a pc when electronics get wrong in that supply, more expensive ones are protected on outputs..
Your scripts I did see the systems but I see also tapped horn stuff on beginning and also later in script, make it more complicated, but david say hornresp can do also things except I believe the higher frequenties are a issue where akabak come at hand.
If I have separate scripts then I can easyer learn and edit it, and later on I can join them.
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Post 94. If you go to post 1 there are links to all build plans.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/261427-presenting-trynergy-full-range-tractrix-synergy-10.html
Use the scale function when printing from pdf to "tile" mode. Print a an example and compare scaling needed to achieve throat size you need.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/261427-presenting-trynergy-full-range-tractrix-synergy-10.html
Use the scale function when printing from pdf to "tile" mode. Print a an example and compare scaling needed to achieve throat size you need.
The wauy I go build it is different then yours, I use up and down conic panels with saw out the tractrix and press that in some layers on the sawing out liner of the panel, horn is not with foam but wood.
I do not now if this will work woth your pdf, it looks that it is possible.
I go look at it. otherwise i drawn it in sketchup is also not so much work.
thanks.
This was my idea to do it with all wood.
I go get some this evening and try what happens.
I go to metric so I do calc again the horn with xls program, also I did see
the little smaller part after mouth is not there in your drawn when I did make in sketchup, (terrable program to make horns, makes no solids sometimes..
This drawn is example, I have not did make the wooden plates conic like it shut be but just give a idea what I want do, making a new calc is not a problem, just do the same as you by make bigger spaces when make the tractrix corners.
I hope I did explane oke, because technical english is not me best way to explane it I am dutch you now and never have english school, just learn by typing it on the internet.
regards
kees
I go get some this evening and try what happens.
I go to metric so I do calc again the horn with xls program, also I did see
the little smaller part after mouth is not there in your drawn when I did make in sketchup, (terrable program to make horns, makes no solids sometimes..
This drawn is example, I have not did make the wooden plates conic like it shut be but just give a idea what I want do, making a new calc is not a problem, just do the same as you by make bigger spaces when make the tractrix corners.
I hope I did explane oke, because technical english is not me best way to explane it I am dutch you now and never have english school, just learn by typing it on the internet.
regards
kees
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You are great at explaining. I have always thought the Dutch speak better English than many Americans.
So you now how I want to do it? and what is your meaning?.
I have the wood, and go try this proberly knack wood aproach.
And thanks that your find explainings oke, yes most dutch people are quite good in languages. and more importent is always understanding and not writing without errors but some people have a issiue with it when writing faults, for me what the heck if the horn get to a good end that is what counts..
Thanks
Nabure has lost the judge case, and has to remove or place it somewhere else but now put on the internet and naburehood that I do sexual things with children to try to get me out of the home what is very serious accusation (do I write it right?) this is wy some people here say nasty things to me from out cars. Police do not do something about it because she are friends with company who is owner of antenna? a ruckus long range wifi 6.8 watts very close to my bed, these things are used on stores and hotels not on livingrooms but Holland do not protect the people but only the company,s and USA do the same right? it is a western problem. I can say the unatural digital signals in the air is not really good for us, pure sinusoidal is not a problem also not with microwaves this is the problem and a new unknown issieu who has to be adressed..
Oke back to the real things, I go work on it, but the antenna has first te be removed because I can not measure, nabure disturb the measurement with big 440 hz pulses. and it sound from amp is like you hold a gsm next to it.
I wil let you now for the exmple test who I can do, that is why I did get wood tonight to see what is the best wooden way..
regards
kees
Nabure has lost the judge case, and has to remove or place it somewhere else but now put on the internet and naburehood that I do sexual things with children to try to get me out of the home what is very serious accusation (do I write it right?) this is wy some people here say nasty things to me from out cars. Police do not do something about it because she are friends with company who is owner of antenna? a ruckus long range wifi 6.8 watts very close to my bed, these things are used on stores and hotels not on livingrooms but Holland do not protect the people but only the company,s and USA do the same right? it is a western problem. I can say the unatural digital signals in the air is not really good for us, pure sinusoidal is not a problem also not with microwaves this is the problem and a new unknown issieu who has to be adressed..
Oke back to the real things, I go work on it, but the antenna has first te be removed because I can not measure, nabure disturb the measurement with big 440 hz pulses. and it sound from amp is like you hold a gsm next to it.
I wil let you now for the exmple test who I can do, that is why I did get wood tonight to see what is the best wooden way..
regards
kees
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I have use 225 Hz as horn cutoff is some lower so oke keeping wideband damped by horn, horn get then 40.8 cm long 34.81 high, and 52.21 wide, looks nice for a livingroom.
mouth earea is 18.3 cm2 0.71 x diagonal of speaker who is 6.1 cm. I make the back chamber of the speaker from plastic pipe, I can make it very small so more easy to get wideband respons, back chamber works like a low pass so make it small enough works best crossover get higher but bass unit go high enough to cope with that I hope, trying is best afcourse...
mouth earea is 18.3 cm2 0.71 x diagonal of speaker who is 6.1 cm. I make the back chamber of the speaker from plastic pipe, I can make it very small so more easy to get wideband respons, back chamber works like a low pass so make it small enough works best crossover get higher but bass unit go high enough to cope with that I hope, trying is best afcourse...
Because I go from scratch, just for the fun but also because I made a wooden one, I have so far I understand need to change the table of horn, the length and the waveguide have to be the same table count in akabak.
I go use more points to draw the horn because of it is from wood, saw this need more points.
I have use the 225Hz calculation, i go use that table, because there are more points I need change it also in akabak including the waveguides.
Why you have so much digits behind comma?
S1T=0.005041000; here S1M=0.007076077; here L1=0.0519;
why not
S1T=0.005; S1M=0.007; L1=0.052;
regards
kees
I go use more points to draw the horn because of it is from wood, saw this need more points.
I have use the 225Hz calculation, i go use that table, because there are more points I need change it also in akabak including the waveguides.
Why you have so much digits behind comma?
S1T=0.005041000; here S1M=0.007076077; here L1=0.0519;
why not
S1T=0.005; S1M=0.007; L1=0.052;
regards
kees
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