10F/8424 & RS225-8 FAST / WAW Ref Monitor

Well, with worse speakers I liked most of my CDs which is not the case anymore now. Maybe they are rather poorly produced as mixed, I do not know. And some of the CDs I cannot listen to anymore as they lack dynamic, some are noisy etc...:( I just listen with my (normal, untrained) ears, do not evaluate with rocket science.

:) enjoy great sound your new build, info was to share about pros and cons so we can learn a bit what characteristic we listen to and have that in mind in conclusions from one system or compromise to another. Think investigate and conclude on system sound stage down the road yourself, one thing worries me and can or not point to yours are laying down and fixed so you can't toe in or out their design axis as xrk971 con do in his setup, a 1st order slope is only down -20dB a decade away from XO point so both drivers have wide influence into final system response and their acoustic timing change relative with horizontal angle to liste position when they lay on its side. Say worry because own experience is the smoother the system response is and the lower various known distortion products can be brought in a system the better more and more various CDs and music genres start to sound and think xrk971 agree here, so the worry goes on you report the other way around. If you happy forget about it but should you want investigate characteristic of new speakers acoustic sound stage think play only one at a time and walk horizontal around it to learn its pros and cons and discover its best axis.
 
Same happens with amps. ...I compare two 25w amps side by side. My trustworthy SMSL 36A pro vs my new ALPHA 20. Absolutely night and day, the detail, the soundstage, the bass authority - all so much better on the good Class A amp.
I fell in love with ICEPower modules but you make me curious. You mean the Aksa Lender P-mos Hybrid Aleph (ALPHA) Amplifier here on DIYAudio?
 
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Same happens with amps. I used to listen to TPA3116 Class D for years. Happy as a clam. Then I start making Class AB and Class A amps, and improve on Class A amps, and then the source becomes important, the speaker wiring is important (I measured this myself - otherwise would not have believed it), but I compare two 25w amps side by side. My trustworthy SMSL 36A pro vs my new ALPHA 20. Absolutely night and day, the detail, the soundstage, the bass authority - all so much better on the good Class A amp (one with very low global feedback, and ideal harmonic profile distortion).

X, would you mind elaborating a bit on the speaker wiring you mentioned in this post?

I could not agree more about amplifiers. When I started listening to my first (F5) class A amps I quickly realized I needed to start improving my sources.
 
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X, would you mind elaborating a bit on the speaker wiring you mentioned in this post?

I could not agree more about amplifiers. When I started listening to my first (F5) class A amps I quickly realized I needed to start improving my sources.

This was measurement of 8ohm dummy load at end of 16ga stranded OFC zipcord vs solid copper 12ga Romex (GND left not connected). The measurements with load connected directly to amp without wire was similar to Romex but actually had higher mains noise. This was with VHEX+ Class AB amp. The Alpha 20 did not have this effect (as much) but I noticed just the opposite was more mains pickup when using 16ga clear vinyl zipcord (moderately priced stuff from PE). It’s kind of a scary can of worms actually. I am the last person to believe in boutique $10k speaker cables. In my case $12 of Romex - but that stuff is rigid like plumbing with copper pipe. Actually, 1/4in copper tubing might not be bad speaker “cable” either.

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/soli...n-simple-quasi-mosfet-amp-35.html#post5355249

Edit: just realized I forgot to post FFT of dummynload at end of 16ga zipcord at 2.83vrms.
 
This was measurement of 8ohm dummy load at end of 16ga stranded OFC zipcord vs solid copper 12ga Romex (GND left not connected). The measurements with load connected directly to amp without wire was similar to Romex but actually had higher mains noise. This was with VHEX+ Class AB amp. The Alpha 20 did not have this effect (as much) but I noticed just the opposite was more mains pickup when using 16ga clear vinyl zipcord (moderately priced stuff from PE). It’s kind of a scary can of worms actually. I am the last person to believe in boutique $10k speaker cables. In my case $12 of Romex - but that stuff is rigid like plumbing with copper pipe. Actually, 1/4in copper tubing might not be bad speaker “cable” either.

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/soli...n-simple-quasi-mosfet-amp-35.html#post5355249

Edit: just realized I forgot to post FFT of dummynload at end of 16ga zipcord at 2.83vrms.


That is quite a can of worms. The results are interesting for sure.

I normally use 16-20g silver plated copper, teflon insulation. I prefer banana plugs if I can get away with them. That's probably another can of worms, banana plugs vs spade vs bare wire, etc.....
 
Not clear to me, is the small end of the "dagger" sealed or open? Also is it sealed around the driver?
Thanks
David
In my case the dagger reinforces the enclosure from the front to rear. Opening in the rear wall makes the dagger vented on the rear end, see the view of the opened box. Second reinforcement between left and right side walls is missing in the pic, glued perpendicular to dagger side.
 

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Hi XRK,

I had a few questions on an alternative design based on this speaker.

Basically an omni on the bass driver with the FR as open baffle to get a cardioid pattern. something similar to lxmini in approach, but hopefully in a bookshelf size.

in Lxmini, the upward firing woofer as i understand overcomes the need to handle baffle step on the listening axi. But i think the small size of the woofer and baffle are also essential to the design.

How would an Satori MW16 in a sonotube work with 10F FR in open baffle.

Can the crossover still be kept passive? Or the corrections needed become complex enough for DSP.
 
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You just have to build it and measure to see how complex the passive XO will be. I know that the 10F in an open baffle is a snap as it is smooth and do what I did for the XO. The Satori is a great driver but I don't know what that looks like in a Sonotube. You could model all this in Akabak (upward firing sonotube and horiz 10F in OB). It will get you very close to what the ideal response could be.
 
You just have to build it and measure to see how complex the passive XO will be. I know that the 10F in an open baffle is a snap as it is smooth and do what I did for the XO. The Satori is a great driver but I don't know what that looks like in a Sonotube. You could model all this in Akabak (upward firing sonotube and horiz 10F in OB). It will get you very close to what the ideal response could be.

Thanks.
 
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I am setting up another headphone amp comparison and put the headphone comparing station in the same spot as the listening position as the 10F/RS225 FAST speakers. It's neat to be able to compare sound from headphone to sound in room through speakers. A new thread for a blind virtual audition of the headphone amps will come out as soon as take the data. At least the workstation is setup now.

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