No problem on 'waffling'. I actually appreciate your chiming in and great advices.
Yes, It will be an integrated stereo/surround system as it is now. The space is fairly long(or deep) with 28' but fairly narrow with 13' width. Ceiling is 10' high, and the left side is completely open. And.... the short wall before which front 3 speakers and most electronics gears are placed is mostly covered by the mirror.
I think it would be a bit challenging for 2 8" audiophile woofers to cover down to 35Hz. I am thinking more like 60~70Hz right now, relying on the SVS for now. I can easily change this setting with a few button press for the bass manager control, so I believe I will listen to all the various reasonable settings to find the optimal one. I don't think it's practical to use a steep FIR filter for such low frequencies, so using LR4 will give me such flexibility and convenience.
In the further future, it would be interesting to have a sidefiring narrow/deep/tall subwoofer modules behind the tall/deep/narrow mains should be interesting in many ways.
Creative Sound is an interesting company, to say the least. I hope it proves much more than that.
Oh, you are already searching for my woofer options! I appreciate it.
I was actually wondering about Seas Excel midbass, but definitely their 8" counterparts could be a good option for the double woofer section. 40 liter option seems most interesting, but I want to look at the sealed option, too.
Before answering all the great advices and suggestions above, I want to let folks here know that I narrowed down the midhigh choice to:
1. Satori MD60N-6 2.5" textile dome
2. Volt VM527 2" textile dome
Regarding Visaton and Dayton, I might revisit them as the 3rd/4th options.
I happened to visit the T.H.E. SoCal 2024 show today, and had a very pleasant surprise. There was a PBN booth which was one of the largest and best-sounding one, as shown in the picture, and I encountered a speaker(being moved to the position in the picture), using some ring radiator tweeter, 2 JBL 10" white paper cone woofers, and the Satori MD60N! It sounded pretty nice and the designer told me that it was crossed over at 850Hz. Since it could play well along with 2 JBL 10" high-efficiency woofers in a huge room, I think I can use it from 700 ~ 850Hz in my setup. So, Satori is actually more likely to be chosen than Volt VM527. It's so stupid of me to forget taking a picture of that speaker!
I believe some of you love the looks and design of the top model PBN speakers in the picture. Huge subwoofer tower, same-diameter huge woofer, and huge(for a midbass) midbass woofers(10"?). I asked about the professional design philosophy and he said, 'exactly, the principle of the professional design'.
I think this is mainly due to my curiosity toward 4-way design and doing something differently this time from my 1st 3-way project of Scanspeak D2904/9500 + ATC SCM75-150 + Volt B2500.1. 3" options may perform better but I've used one once already, so.... ;=)
I'd love to hear about your choices of midbass drivers and its enclosures. My first choice is Scanspeak 18WU4741T, but I just realized it's freakin' expensive, a bit more than I am willing to spend without a thought. Revelator slitted paper cone comes to mind as a 2nd. And, of course, all your suggestions are welcome, but gotta be smaller than 8".
1. Satori MD60N-6 2.5" textile dome
2. Volt VM527 2" textile dome
Regarding Visaton and Dayton, I might revisit them as the 3rd/4th options.
I happened to visit the T.H.E. SoCal 2024 show today, and had a very pleasant surprise. There was a PBN booth which was one of the largest and best-sounding one, as shown in the picture, and I encountered a speaker(being moved to the position in the picture), using some ring radiator tweeter, 2 JBL 10" white paper cone woofers, and the Satori MD60N! It sounded pretty nice and the designer told me that it was crossed over at 850Hz. Since it could play well along with 2 JBL 10" high-efficiency woofers in a huge room, I think I can use it from 700 ~ 850Hz in my setup. So, Satori is actually more likely to be chosen than Volt VM527. It's so stupid of me to forget taking a picture of that speaker!
I believe some of you love the looks and design of the top model PBN speakers in the picture. Huge subwoofer tower, same-diameter huge woofer, and huge(for a midbass) midbass woofers(10"?). I asked about the professional design philosophy and he said, 'exactly, the principle of the professional design'.
I think this is mainly due to my curiosity toward 4-way design and doing something differently this time from my 1st 3-way project of Scanspeak D2904/9500 + ATC SCM75-150 + Volt B2500.1. 3" options may perform better but I've used one once already, so.... ;=)
I'd love to hear about your choices of midbass drivers and its enclosures. My first choice is Scanspeak 18WU4741T, but I just realized it's freakin' expensive, a bit more than I am willing to spend without a thought. Revelator slitted paper cone comes to mind as a 2nd. And, of course, all your suggestions are welcome, but gotta be smaller than 8".
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Looks amazing.Before answering all the great advices and suggestions above, I want to let folks here know that I narrowed down the midhigh choice to:
1. Satori MD60N-6 2.5" textile dome
2. Volt VM527 2" textile dome
Regarding Visaton and Dayton, I might revisit them as the 3rd/4th options.
I happened to visit the T.H.E. SoCal 2024 show today, and had a very pleasant surprise. There was a PBN boost which was one of the largest and best-sounding one, as shown in the picture, and I encountered a speaker(being moved to the position in the picture), using some ring radiator tweeter, 2 JBL 10" white paper cone woofers, and the Satori MD60N! It sounded pretty nice and the designer told me that it was crossed over at 850Hz. Since it could play well along with 2 JBL 10" high-efficiency woofers in a huge room, I think I can use it from 700 ~ 850Hz in my setup. So, Satori is actually more likely to be chosen than Volt VM527. It's so stupid of me to forget taking a picture of that speaker!
I believe some of you love the looks and design of the top model PBN speakers in the picture. Huge subwoofer tower, same-diameter huge woofer, and huge(for a midbass) midbass woofers(10"?). I asked about the professional design philosophy and he said, 'exactly, the principle of the professional design'.
I think this is mainly due to my curiosity toward 4-way design and doing something differently this time from my 1st 3-way project of Scanspeak D2904/9500 + ATC SCM75-150 + Volt B2500.1. 3" options may perform better but I've used one once already, so.... ;=)
I'd love to hear about your choices of midbass drivers and its enclosures. My first choice is Scanspeak 18WU4741T, but I just realized it's freakin' expensive, a bit more than I am willing to spend without a thought. Revelator slitted paper cone comes to mind as a 2nd. And, of course, all your suggestions are welcome, but gotta be smaller than 8".
Given the svs sub may not be to your musical likes then shouldn’t it be delegated to home theatre ELF bass only.
Therefore are you planning a 3 or a four way stand alone left and right?
Looking at your room the idea of a sealed bass driver with 12 db octave slope might work close to the wall.
Typical near a room wall a boundary effect occurs between 3-6 db on the bass below 100 hertz.
The can be simulated with a shelf EQ filter.
The beauty of a sealed woofer is it can self equalise to a much lower F3 in - room frequency without the typical bass hump of a bass reflex system.
This is a simulation using an Acoustic Elegance
It’s a massive driver.
I have simulated a +3 Db shelf at 100 hertz and a +6 db shelf at 100 hertz. The effect of pushing the enclosure near the wall in other worlds.
Or turns out really nice.
A Q of 0.7 is 25 L
A bezel Q of 0577 is 50 L
You would only need one 10 inch woofer in 25 W x 21 D x 50 cm H enclosure.
The maximum in room bass output is 115 db at 30 hertz.
Not sure a mid bass driver would be necessary. I have an AE TD15 and they are nice. These SBP drivers are spec’d for sealed enclosures. These drivers are in some hi end OEM systems.
Therefore are you planning a 3 or a four way stand alone left and right?
Looking at your room the idea of a sealed bass driver with 12 db octave slope might work close to the wall.
Typical near a room wall a boundary effect occurs between 3-6 db on the bass below 100 hertz.
The can be simulated with a shelf EQ filter.
The beauty of a sealed woofer is it can self equalise to a much lower F3 in - room frequency without the typical bass hump of a bass reflex system.
This is a simulation using an Acoustic Elegance
SBP10
The x max is 14 mm.It’s a massive driver.
I have simulated a +3 Db shelf at 100 hertz and a +6 db shelf at 100 hertz. The effect of pushing the enclosure near the wall in other worlds.
Or turns out really nice.
A Q of 0.7 is 25 L
A bezel Q of 0577 is 50 L
You would only need one 10 inch woofer in 25 W x 21 D x 50 cm H enclosure.
The maximum in room bass output is 115 db at 30 hertz.
Not sure a mid bass driver would be necessary. I have an AE TD15 and they are nice. These SBP drivers are spec’d for sealed enclosures. These drivers are in some hi end OEM systems.
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Where l am coming from with the 10 inch AE woofer is its capable of being a foundation for musical lows. If you rely on the SVS for say 50 hertz and below there might be continuity issues to a hifi mid base driver.
Given the AE works in a sealed acoustic suspension enclosure and will cover up to at least 500 hertz you might not need a mid bass driver.
The caveat however is the width and shape of your AE woofer baffle. Tallish narrow baffles incur a baffle step loss of up to 6 db. Your woofer on paper will be of low sensitivity below the baffle step frequency. (300- 600 hertz).
This is the problem with a narrow baffle.
The only way around this is a wider baffle or to stack two or more woofers to compensate for the baffle step. The bottom woofer will only go up as high as the baffle step frequency.
This is done by numerous manufacturers like Kef and Focal.
Alternatively is to place the bass (low woofer) close to the floor as shown in my sketch. This will enable all the output of the driver to reflect rather than diffract giving a linear response too 100 hertz or so.
It’s the Alison design idea. You will obtain much smoother bass without any downside with this approach.
Some hi end designs with weird triffid alien shaped enclosureshapes use this approach to fool the laws of physics when it comes to acoustics.
The mid bass lower mid driver then takes over. Placing it well up off the floor outside the wave length of floor cancellation with give a smooth response.
You could use numerous drivers for this task from 100-150 hertz to 3,500 hertz .
The styling l have depicted is like the Avantguard design that is framed on each side by a curved plywood side panels
You are best to download the Jeff Bagley Excel Diffraction modeling spreadsheet and make some predictions.
This is the sort of unannounced problem diy loudspeaker builders can run into.
Given the AE works in a sealed acoustic suspension enclosure and will cover up to at least 500 hertz you might not need a mid bass driver.
The caveat however is the width and shape of your AE woofer baffle. Tallish narrow baffles incur a baffle step loss of up to 6 db. Your woofer on paper will be of low sensitivity below the baffle step frequency. (300- 600 hertz).
This is the problem with a narrow baffle.
The only way around this is a wider baffle or to stack two or more woofers to compensate for the baffle step. The bottom woofer will only go up as high as the baffle step frequency.
This is done by numerous manufacturers like Kef and Focal.
Alternatively is to place the bass (low woofer) close to the floor as shown in my sketch. This will enable all the output of the driver to reflect rather than diffract giving a linear response too 100 hertz or so.
It’s the Alison design idea. You will obtain much smoother bass without any downside with this approach.
Some hi end designs with weird triffid alien shaped enclosureshapes use this approach to fool the laws of physics when it comes to acoustics.
The mid bass lower mid driver then takes over. Placing it well up off the floor outside the wave length of floor cancellation with give a smooth response.
You could use numerous drivers for this task from 100-150 hertz to 3,500 hertz .
The styling l have depicted is like the Avantguard design that is framed on each side by a curved plywood side panels
You are best to download the Jeff Bagley Excel Diffraction modeling spreadsheet and make some predictions.
This is the sort of unannounced problem diy loudspeaker builders can run into.
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Wow, this, and the other post below that I can't quote yet, gives me a lot to think about. It seems that you call the double 8" woofers midbass, as 8" is the usual diameter for professional midbass drivers. I am planning on the 4-way standalone first, using with SVS in the beginning, and build a side-firing subwoofer module(non-ELF) later if all the situations permit. Since it is double woofer config already just for my gut feeling and WAF, it seems to address a bit of baffle step issue, right? If you meant to use 1 or 2 10" for tall/narrow woofer module, I am afraid WAF prohibits it...
SBP10 looks great, except being a bit peaky in the FR of interest, and the price. DSP should be able to flatten the peak, but price, especially used double config seems quite more than I would spend. For the side-firing woofer module, more affordable 13~15" ones seem better. Any suggestion? Please also advise me on the idea of side-firing subwoofer module.
For your suggestion of midbass on top of tweeter and woofer down at bottom, how about T-MH-MB-W-W layout with 1 woofer on the top and one down the bottom? Tuning the bass for corner placement should also be evaluated, but it seems easy to test when the cabinet is complete.
I happened to run across this video from the show (I think) yesterday, and it gave some more info about the various designs.
I think the side firing / opposing subs will be the easiest to narrow down and my initial gut feel is the Beyma 15 LX 60 Mk 2 https://www.beyma.com/speakers/Fich...ers-data-sheet-low-mid-frequency-15LX60V2.pdf but I am am sure there will be other good choices available and I would suggest that you can save a bit of $$ per driver here without compromising on system sound quality.
I will do a sim in a mo.
Ok, good news and bad news on the Beyma 15 LX60 Mk 2...
Good news: An opposing pair per cabinet will deliver superb results with a Q of 0.75. Personally I would use 0.65 with this set up but that needs 178 liters, but I like wider baffles.
Bad news: Your bass cabinet will need to be tall and deep if you restrict the front width to around 22cm (internal) ie WHD of 22cm by 82cm by 65cm = 111 liters.
If this is too big a single driver per cabinet will still produce 106dB at 30 Hz with 256 watts and 4.75 cone travel when you have two cabinets.... Then add at least 3dB room/boundary gain and you have more than enough SPL for room shaking performance and still staying well within the drivers thermal and XMax limits.
Note on opposing drivers "force cancellation". This can be very advantageous, but only where the cabinets are typical MDF or Plywood box construction and light weight ie under 40Kg, and 40Kg is considered heavy by many commercial designers.
I will post more on this in minute... got to dash at the mo.
Good news: An opposing pair per cabinet will deliver superb results with a Q of 0.75. Personally I would use 0.65 with this set up but that needs 178 liters, but I like wider baffles.
Bad news: Your bass cabinet will need to be tall and deep if you restrict the front width to around 22cm (internal) ie WHD of 22cm by 82cm by 65cm = 111 liters.
If this is too big a single driver per cabinet will still produce 106dB at 30 Hz with 256 watts and 4.75 cone travel when you have two cabinets.... Then add at least 3dB room/boundary gain and you have more than enough SPL for room shaking performance and still staying well within the drivers thermal and XMax limits.
Note on opposing drivers "force cancellation". This can be very advantageous, but only where the cabinets are typical MDF or Plywood box construction and light weight ie under 40Kg, and 40Kg is considered heavy by many commercial designers.
I will post more on this in minute... got to dash at the mo.
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When the WW2 battle ships fired huge shells weighing over 1 ton from their 16 inch (!) guns the whole ship was "pushed back" in the ocean by about a meter(!) which was calculted and allowed for by the gun crew... No computer guidance back then! ie For every action there is an equal and opposite re-action"
Now when a sailor stood on the deck and fired a pistol there was also an equal and opposite reaction but insignificantly small as far as pushing the ship back in the ocean is concerened.
So IF a 15 inch bass cone with a Mms of say 100g (15 inch cones can vary from 50g full range /wheezer cone types to 500g car subwoofers) was placed in a 10Kg spiked cabinet it would literally "walk" across the room at high SPL with 40Hz or below.
Now, take the same driver at the same SPL and frequency in a 100Kg spiked cabinet and it is not moving anywhere... Trust me I have done this experiment many times with many drivers / cabinets/weights and materials.
Not only can you see, hear and measure the light weight cabinet issues you can easily hear the improvements as your ratio of total driver moving mass to total cabinet weigh improves.
Long story short- weight matters! The key take aways are:
The extreme "Overkill" solution is get as close to 800 to 1,000 times the driver(s) Mms with static cabinet weight. This is to be 100% sure. Sure as in Aliens 2 Ripley quote- " I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure. "
So thats an 88Kg mid bass cabinet.... OMG!
Now in the real world the cabinet for the 88g Mms 15 P80 only needs to be around 40Kg to 45Kg... Why?
Because diminishing returns means that as long as you exceed 500 times the Mms you get most of the sonic improvements... circa 80% if I had to average it out.
Also the driver itself weighs 12.5 Kg, so the cabinet (including large brass spikes, cables and connectors) only needs to weigh around 30 Kg to get great results and 45Kg cabinet plus driver will be superb.
Important.... It gets easier to achieve 500 to 800 times Mms when you allow for cabinet "stacking." The weight of mid/top cabinet is "weighing down" the mid bass... Both of these weigh down the subs... So you can still use a single large bass / sub and not worry about cabinet vibrations blurring your sound.... BUT you still have to choose the right materials and construction... Thats another story!
Now when a sailor stood on the deck and fired a pistol there was also an equal and opposite reaction but insignificantly small as far as pushing the ship back in the ocean is concerened.
So IF a 15 inch bass cone with a Mms of say 100g (15 inch cones can vary from 50g full range /wheezer cone types to 500g car subwoofers) was placed in a 10Kg spiked cabinet it would literally "walk" across the room at high SPL with 40Hz or below.
Now, take the same driver at the same SPL and frequency in a 100Kg spiked cabinet and it is not moving anywhere... Trust me I have done this experiment many times with many drivers / cabinets/weights and materials.
Not only can you see, hear and measure the light weight cabinet issues you can easily hear the improvements as your ratio of total driver moving mass to total cabinet weigh improves.
Long story short- weight matters! The key take aways are:
The extreme "Overkill" solution is get as close to 800 to 1,000 times the driver(s) Mms with static cabinet weight. This is to be 100% sure. Sure as in Aliens 2 Ripley quote- " I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure. "
So thats an 88Kg mid bass cabinet.... OMG!
Now in the real world the cabinet for the 88g Mms 15 P80 only needs to be around 40Kg to 45Kg... Why?
Because diminishing returns means that as long as you exceed 500 times the Mms you get most of the sonic improvements... circa 80% if I had to average it out.
Also the driver itself weighs 12.5 Kg, so the cabinet (including large brass spikes, cables and connectors) only needs to weigh around 30 Kg to get great results and 45Kg cabinet plus driver will be superb.
Important.... It gets easier to achieve 500 to 800 times Mms when you allow for cabinet "stacking." The weight of mid/top cabinet is "weighing down" the mid bass... Both of these weigh down the subs... So you can still use a single large bass / sub and not worry about cabinet vibrations blurring your sound.... BUT you still have to choose the right materials and construction... Thats another story!
A mid bass driver is a driver that typically has an extended mid range and less low bass. It can be any diameter.
For bass an 8 inch woofer has real limitations unless it has a long Xmax. Such drivers exist but have high mass cones and have limited bandwidth.
In my outline the SP10 would only be used up to 100-150 hertz. It may cost more but these are truely hi end drivers that deliver. Long Xmas is necessary in a seal enclosure. Do not used a low Q bass reflex woofer as a sealed enclosure. It will have significantly limited output. You need a long throw long VC, low FS and a Q of 0.4 or above or it won't work properly as a hifi woofer
Visation also make an excellent range of woofers designed for sealed enclosures
https://www.visaton.de/en/products/drivers/woofers/tiw-250-xs-8-ohm
https://www.visaton.de/en/products/drivers/woofers/tiw-300-8-ohm
The idea of a woofer on each side looks cool but is unnecessary. You only need one good one.
You could try T-MH-MB-W-W as a modular approach and work it out at prototype phase. Have a look at the Wilson designs on their layouts.
Troels has used different pro 15 inch woofers. But all as bass reflex. You will be disappointed if you attempt to seal these woofers.
I disagree with Mack (and Troels!!) on all of this:
"Long Xmas is necessary in a seal enclosure.
You need a long throw long VC, low FS and a Q of 0.4 or above or it won't work properly as a hifi woofer
Troels has used different pro 15 inch woofers. But all as bass reflex. You will be disappointed if you attempt to seal these woofers."
"Long Xmas is necessary in a seal enclosure.
You need a long throw long VC, low FS and a Q of 0.4 or above or it won't work properly as a hifi woofer
Troels has used different pro 15 inch woofers. But all as bass reflex. You will be disappointed if you attempt to seal these woofers."
I think the side firing / opposing subs will be the easiest to narrow down and my initial gut feel is the Beyma 15 LX 60 Mk 2 https://www.beyma.com/speakers/Fich...ers-data-sheet-low-mid-frequency-15LX60V2.pdf but I am am sure there will be other good choices available and I would suggest that you can save a bit of $$ per driver here without compromising on system sound quality.
Thank you for going ahead with this, but let's not hurry on the subwoofer module which I have no idea when I can start. I don't want your effort wasted.
And I don't think I will go with 2 13"~15" woofers per side for the subwoofer module. I think that's way too much of everything including SPL for me.
Thank you for going ahead with this, but let's not hurry on the subwoofer module which I have no idea when I can start. I don't want your effort wasted.
And I don't think I will go with 2 13"~15" woofers per side for the subwoofer module. I think that's way too much of everything including SPL for me.
When the WW2 battle ships fired huge shells weighing over 1 ton from their 16 inch (!) guns the whole ship was "pushed back" in the ocean by about a meter(!) which was calculted and allowed for by the gun crew... No computer guidance back then! ie For every action there is an equal and opposite re-action"
Now when a sailor stood on the deck and fired a pistol there was also an equal and opposite reaction but insignificantly small as far as pushing the ship back in the ocean is concerened.
So IF a 15 inch bass cone with a Mms of say 100g (15 inch cones can vary from 50g full range /wheezer cone types to 500g car subwoofers) was placed in a 10Kg spiked cabinet it would literally "walk" across the room at high SPL with 40Hz or below.
Now, take the same driver at the same SPL and frequency in a 100Kg spiked cabinet and it is not moving anywhere... Trust me I have done this experiment many times with many drivers / cabinets/weights and materials.
Not only can you see, hear and measure the light weight cabinet issues you can easily hear the improvements as your ratio of total driver moving mass to total cabinet weigh improves.
Long story short- weight matters! The key take aways are:
The extreme "Overkill" solution is get as close to 800 to 1,000 times the driver(s) Mms with static cabinet weight. This is to be 100% sure. Sure as in Aliens 2 Ripley quote- " I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure. "
So thats an 88Kg mid bass cabinet.... OMG!
Now in the real world the cabinet for the 88g Mms 15 P80 only needs to be around 40Kg to 45Kg... Why?
Because diminishing returns means that as long as you exceed 500 times the Mms you get most of the sonic improvements... circa 80% if I had to average it out.
Also the driver itself weighs 12.5 Kg, so the cabinet (including large brass spikes, cables and connectors) only needs to weigh around 30 Kg to get great results and 45Kg cabinet plus driver will be superb.
Important.... It gets easier to achieve 500 to 800 times Mms when you allow for cabinet "stacking." The weight of mid/top cabinet is "weighing down" the mid bass... Both of these weigh down the subs... So you can still use a single large bass / sub and not worry about cabinet vibrations blurring your sound.... BUT you still have to choose the right materials and construction... Thats another story!
I am afraid there is a confusion. I also prefer heavy bass module, but still in reasoable weight for 2 8" woofers. Since this bass module is smaller than or similar to the size of my current one, 50 ~ 60kg seems appropriate.
BTW, what I meant for 2 woofers bottom and top was, one woofer on the top part of the bass module and one at the bottom to mitigate the baffle step issue. So, after the stacking, the layout will be still tweeter - midhigh - midbass - bass module. I read it again and realized that it could be interpreted as woofer A - tweeter - midhigh - midbass - woofer B...
Since there will be a midbass above the woofers, I guess using 8" heavy long-excursion drivers should be okay. I think the woofers will go no higher than 300Hz, and now lower than 60Hz, in my tentative thinking.
I have no issue with different points of view. This is diy after all.
Here is an explanation of the suitability of a woofer for either a bass reflex or sealed enclosure or one or the other.
"To find out which enclosure is best suited for your woofer, you need to calculate the Efficiency Bandwidth Product (EBP). Simply divide Fs / Qes and if you get a number between 50 and 100, the woofer is suitable for either one (lower than 50 is best for sealed and higher than 100 is best for bass reflex)."
https://audiojudgement.com/sealed-v...d out which enclosure,is best for bass reflex).
On the driver motor if a sealed enclosure is going to deliver lows with appreciable authority (not just small signal) it needs to be long throw. Otherwise when compared to an equivalent size bass reflex system (with the help of the port output) the sealed system will have significantly less low frequency capability. This is about the displacement to move the air load behind and in front of the cone with low distortion. Once the linear region of the BL is exceeded harmonic distortion increases quickly. 2nd order H2 diction is bad for bass notes.
The 10 inch AE woofer I referred to above has a 14 mm peak Max. The Xmech is 18mm peak while the Vc is rated at 500 watts. VB 25L
Allowing for just 3 db of room boundary reinforcement the single SDP10 VB 25L QTC 0.71
116 db at 50 hertz
114 db at 40 hertz
111 db at 30 hertz
For comparison some alternative drivers below.
The Seas W26FX002 with 7mm xmax fs 31 hertz, Vas 87 L, Qts 0.39. VB 29L, 0.71
109.5 db at 50 hertz
107 db at 40 hertz
103.8 db at 30 hertz
The sb acoustics sw26dac 76/4 with xmax 12 mm fs 22 hertz, VAS 54, QTS 0.51. VB 28L QTC 0.71. VB 28 etc 0.71
109.9 db at 50 hertz
109 db at 40 hertz
107 db at 30 hertz
The Beyma 15LX60V2. xmax 9 mm, fs 42 hertz, VAS 105, Q's 0.44. VB 95L QTC 0.71
122 db at 50 hertz
119 db at 40 hertz
115 db at 30 hertz
In your scenario you want useful bass to 35 hertz and descent authority at 40 hertz in a relatively small enclosure.
All the above 10 inch woofers can work in a compact sealed
Woofer placement
Placing the woofer close to the floor provides useful gain typically +3 db and up to +6 db at a wall floor junction in the 40 hertz region. This enables the use of a compact sealed enclosure.
Enclosure size
Larger woofers require much larger enclosures. The trade off is efficiency versus enclosure volume
Low end authority
As can be seen all the 10 inch woofers work at 50 hertz. The difference is in the x max which impacts on the output below 40 hertz. The SDP 10 has the edge on power handling while the SB acoustics woofer is good. The Beyma enclosure 3x larger.
Here is an explanation of the suitability of a woofer for either a bass reflex or sealed enclosure or one or the other.
"To find out which enclosure is best suited for your woofer, you need to calculate the Efficiency Bandwidth Product (EBP). Simply divide Fs / Qes and if you get a number between 50 and 100, the woofer is suitable for either one (lower than 50 is best for sealed and higher than 100 is best for bass reflex)."
https://audiojudgement.com/sealed-v...d out which enclosure,is best for bass reflex).
On the driver motor if a sealed enclosure is going to deliver lows with appreciable authority (not just small signal) it needs to be long throw. Otherwise when compared to an equivalent size bass reflex system (with the help of the port output) the sealed system will have significantly less low frequency capability. This is about the displacement to move the air load behind and in front of the cone with low distortion. Once the linear region of the BL is exceeded harmonic distortion increases quickly. 2nd order H2 diction is bad for bass notes.
The 10 inch AE woofer I referred to above has a 14 mm peak Max. The Xmech is 18mm peak while the Vc is rated at 500 watts. VB 25L
Allowing for just 3 db of room boundary reinforcement the single SDP10 VB 25L QTC 0.71
116 db at 50 hertz
114 db at 40 hertz
111 db at 30 hertz
For comparison some alternative drivers below.
The Seas W26FX002 with 7mm xmax fs 31 hertz, Vas 87 L, Qts 0.39. VB 29L, 0.71
109.5 db at 50 hertz
107 db at 40 hertz
103.8 db at 30 hertz
The sb acoustics sw26dac 76/4 with xmax 12 mm fs 22 hertz, VAS 54, QTS 0.51. VB 28L QTC 0.71. VB 28 etc 0.71
109.9 db at 50 hertz
109 db at 40 hertz
107 db at 30 hertz
The Beyma 15LX60V2. xmax 9 mm, fs 42 hertz, VAS 105, Q's 0.44. VB 95L QTC 0.71
122 db at 50 hertz
119 db at 40 hertz
115 db at 30 hertz
In your scenario you want useful bass to 35 hertz and descent authority at 40 hertz in a relatively small enclosure.
All the above 10 inch woofers can work in a compact sealed
Woofer placement
Placing the woofer close to the floor provides useful gain typically +3 db and up to +6 db at a wall floor junction in the 40 hertz region. This enables the use of a compact sealed enclosure.
Enclosure size
Larger woofers require much larger enclosures. The trade off is efficiency versus enclosure volume
Low end authority
As can be seen all the 10 inch woofers work at 50 hertz. The difference is in the x max which impacts on the output below 40 hertz. The SDP 10 has the edge on power handling while the SB acoustics woofer is good. The Beyma enclosure 3x larger.
Attachments
My apologies for pontificating .....Lol. But again these exercises bridge the gap from arm chair diy spec surfing to determining or grouping the complimentary trade offs that might be acceptable in your scenario.
In the above comparisons you get a feel for the kind of woofer that meets your needs by simulating them. This helps fresh out other considerations.
Size
Performance
Cost
Criteria
WAF (narrow slender profile)
Accurate bass (extension, output, distortion)
Budget
Standalone system with in room extension to 35 hertz
Adequate dynamic bass authority for music
The mid and the tweeter is the easy part.
In the above comparisons you get a feel for the kind of woofer that meets your needs by simulating them. This helps fresh out other considerations.
Size
Performance
Cost
Criteria
WAF (narrow slender profile)
Accurate bass (extension, output, distortion)
Budget
Standalone system with in room extension to 35 hertz
Adequate dynamic bass authority for music
The mid and the tweeter is the easy part.